One Step Forwards, Two Steps Back – She Wants to Go Back To Not Having Sex

Hi Moxie,

Wondering what you and your readers will have to say about this. I’ve had 3 dates with a woman. On the 2nd date we had sex. A couple of weeks later (she was out of town for a week) she said she wanted to go back to not having sex. She’s a great girl and the last time we saw each other (our 3rd date) we didn’t have sex. I went over to her place to watch a movie. The conversation about sex came up and she said something like, “I don’t want this to just be about sex.” I said, “I completely understand, but want you to know it’s not.” Time went by and we almost started messing around and she said, “I don’t want this to lead to sex tonight” and it completely killed the mood. When the conversation came up I reminded her that I’ve tried to do things outside of my apartment and hers, but schedule conflicts seem to prevent that from happening thus far.

I was trying to be very cool about the situation and said something about hanging out the next day. She then said, “Well, I won’t know until later tomorrow.” As we continued talking I said, “You have to understand where I’m coming from. You canceled plans last night, and here I am trying to make plans with you (outside of our apartments) and you’re asking me to keep my schedule open for that day… with no clue if you are going to be free or not.”

The situation was rather frustrating. She’s not a shady girl at all, but I don’t think she understood how things were coming off. Also, I asked her to a movie last night, and she’s the one that suggested I come to her place.

We talked for a bit longer, but I eventually ended up leaving shortly after. I tried to explain that boundaries like that are very limiting and seem problematic from a chemistry standpoint.

In my mind I thought she would have been game since we hadn’t seen each other in a week or so… but it most certainly didn’t feel that way. – Greg, 34, Boston

She’s not a shady girl at all,

That’s your first mistake.

She is shady. Shady meaning either she’s unaware of why she’s doing what she’s doing (which will lead to a looooot of disagreements) or she’s well aware of what she’s doing and being manipulative. You’re seeing what you want to see and over looking big, giant red flags.  You’re torn. You want to give her the benefit of the doubt. But something inside you won’t let you fully commit to that intention. LISTEN TO THAT VOICE!! If you tell her you’re not just in it for sex, and she trusts you, then why not just have sex? If she can take you at your word, then why the hesitancy? Here’s why: she either doesn’t believe you (and good luck convincing her) or..she just likes watching you squirm.

Sorry, but nobody over the age of 25 should invite someone over to their apartment unless they plan on having sex. Period. She’s doing the whole “omigod , I’m not that kind of girl who screws guys on the second date.” Honey, we’re all that type of girl at some time or another. I’d say 80% of men, when their date has sex with them on the first or second date, are so relieved at the lack of game playing that they can’t be bothered to wonder with how many other men you’ve done this. If the man likes you, the sex isn’t going to change that. Where these types of men get concerned, as DMN once mentioned recently, is if the woman acts too detached or too casual about sex or talks about sex in a way that devalues or objectifies her lovers.( This is why so many dating bloggers find themselves on the receiving end of The Fade more times than they can count, BTW. If you write about your dates/lovers as plot devices or props instead of people, you can expect guys to not call you back.)

She’s testing you to see if you’re genuinely interested in her. She’s making you jump through hoops so you can prove to her that you really like her and not just interested in having sex with her.

It won’t stop here. It will be an endless series of tests. People who behave this way always end up being way too much work.

This woman is not emotionally healthy. People whose behavior is inconsistent like this – that’s a warning that something is off. These sorts of people – men and women – can do a lot of damage if you don’t take control of the situation right away.

If you want to continue seeing her, you have to make it clear to her that you feel this taking two steps back thing isn’t a productive move. Not because you want to have sex but because you feel it’s manipulative. You have to stand your ground here. She honestly might not even be aware that she’s doing it. If you point it out to her and say that your intentions are honest, hopefully she’ll feel more comfortable. But if that roller coaster starts again and you feel like she’s picking fights (bad sign!!!) then you have to grab your balls and leave. You will not change her. She might never change. You’re not about to play Henry Higgins.

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61 Responses to “One Step Forwards, Two Steps Back – She Wants to Go Back To Not Having Sex”

  1. Maruska Morena Says:

    It really sounds like the woman is scared. She’s probably been accused of being too loose, and has been told that’s why men leave. She probably doesn’t trust herself not to jump him every time she sees him.. and is scared that that is all he sees in her as well.

    I agree, she’s probably not got her head on straight. Whether its temporary or a full-time mental disorder, its hard to say.

    I’d let her come to him when it comes to sex. if he really likes her. Otherwise, he probably should be looking elsewhere.

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  2. Saj Says:

    Wow looks like her anxiety is getting the best of her. Her body is pushing one agenda (sex) and her brain and fears are pushing another (being used) and she’ll end up creating a self fulfilling prophecy when the guy gets frustrated at the yo yo of emotions and bails and she’ll blame it on the sex rather then being all over the place.

    Obviously this woman isn’t the sort who can emotionally handle sex early on but has crappy discipline in making sure that doesn’t happen and the OP gets to suffer. I don’t know what he can do other then be patient and hope she calms down or cut his losses now. Bugging her to have sex will probably just put her on the defensive and I bet If he plays it cool and relaxed she’ll be initiating sex with him asap anyway.

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  3. nikki04 Says:

    I agree wholeheartedly – for the most part. Absolutely this girl may be being manipulative. If honest conversations have been had, and she’s either not forthcoming with info, or says one thing and does another – just get out now. Bummer. But yeah.

    On the other hand. I have to argue that she may just have given in to sex more quickly than she meant to. Maybe she’d be more comfortable if you slowed down physically. I think, if she’s being honest and not breaking plans for here on out, there is the possibility that she just needs to back it up a little. And I do disagree that being in someone’s apartment must equal sex. There’s a lot that can be done for fun, and the end result doesn’t have to be sex.

    I say talk to her. Explain as you did here, and see what she says – as Moxie and Maruska advised. Also, ask her WHY she needs to put the brakes on, explain how that makes you feel, and ask when she would be more comfortable. Go from there.

    My two cents anyway! :)

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    • Crotch Rocket Says:

      “I do disagree that being in someone’s apartment must equal sex.” Must it? Of course not. However, that is how the other person is almost always going to interpret it, and they’re going to be pissed off if you (appear to) play games by saying that’s not what you meant.

      I will modify the rule slightly, though, to apply only after dark. Inviting someone over in full daylight just doesn’t carry the same implication.

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  4. Burbgirl Says:

    I have no real thoughts as to why this particular woman is acting the way she is—whether she’s a tease, a head case, or just confused. But I wanted to pipe in with a question similar to the one she poses—how does one tell whether the other person is just in it for the sex? (Not that there’s anything wrong with that …)

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    • Crotch Rocket Says:

      Watch for them doing things they don’t (think they) need to in order to get laid. Of course, the more conditions you put on sex, the harder this gets.

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  5. Paula Says:

    I think this is what happens when people try to follow someone else’s rules, or some kind of dating code. She probably had a girlfriend tell her that she slept with you too soon for you to develop a real relationship, and so she’s scrambling to cover her “mistake.”

    Obviously, you don’t think it’s a mistake, and wanted to see her again, but now, with all her mixed messages, it’s understandable that you’re confused. And if this tug of war continues, you’re going to keep fighting and probably give up on wanting to be with her. And then when you give up, she’ll rationalize that you just wanted sex and didn’t like being called on it, when that wasn’t the case at all.

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  6. M Says:

    Not everyone lives in NY, and not everyone has the same attitude toward sex as seems to be common in NY. Even if this girl is in NY, doesnt necessarily mean she has the same attitude toward sex as those who live there. My guess is that she really isnt the kind of girl who puts out on the 2nd date. She had a lapse in judgment, but now she is torn between wanting to see and do things (not sex) with him because she likes him and wanting to distance herself from him because she feels ashamed and she sees him as the symbolization of a mistake she made.
    If Greg wants to continue to see her, he needs to prove to her that he is able and willing to do things with her that do not involve sex before he tries to get in her pants again. It would probably also help if he explained to her that to him, going to her place (or his) = sex. But seeing as to how she set the tone for this relationship by giving it up early, she needs to show she really isnt like that, it thats what she wants him to know. That doesnt mean she should make him jump through an endless number of hoops, but I think its only fair that he should have to prove he is interested in her, and not just doing her because she is an easy lay for him.

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    • Crotch Rocket Says:

      “she really isnt the kind of girl who puts out on the 2nd date.” She is quite obviously the kind of girl who puts out on the second date, as evidenced by doing so with the OP. It’s that simple. And there’s nothing inherently wrong with that.

      “he needs to prove to her that he is able and willing to do things with her that do not involve sex” Did you read his entire question? He has been trying to do so, but she nixed that and then invited him to her place instead–and then got mad at him for thinking she wanted to have sex again. How fucked up is that?

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      • Jay_D2 Says:

        >She is quite obviously the kind of girl who puts out on the second date, as evidenced by doing so with the OP. It’s that simple. And there’s nothing inherently wrong with that.

        Well…I think when people write that, what they really mean is “she really isnt the kind of girl who [normally/has ever/etc] puts out on the 2nd date.”

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  7. Trouble Says:

    Saj :Obviously this woman isn’t the sort who can emotionally handle sex early on but has crappy discipline in making sure that doesn’t happen and the OP gets to suffer. I don’t know what he can do other then be patient and hope she calms down or cut his losses now. Bugging her to have sex will probably just put her on the defensive and I bet If he plays it cool and relaxed she’ll be initiating sex with him asap anyway.

    I was this girl for a long time. I stopped having sex on second dates as a result. If you want to continue to put up with this, you need to be very clear and explicit as to the mixed messages that she is sending and how it is affecting your level of interest in her. I think that she’s trying to transition into being someone who doesn’t sleep with a guy on the second date, but she doesn’t really understand why or how someone would do this. As a result, she is coming across as having a split personality. You would do her a favor by telling her this.

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  8. Trouble Says:

    And, it’s a little late to decide to become this person after you’ve already slept with the guy. It just confuses him and makes you look crazy. Which is what the OP is dealing with, unfortunately.

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    • Crotch Rocket Says:

      Exactly. And, as Paula notes, she is (perhaps unconsciously) creating a situation where he will give up on her so that she can blame him for only wanting sex, when in reality her game-playing drove off a guy who was actually interested in more.

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  9. Slow it down Says:

    I am having trouble believing that you guys are not seeing the state as I see because I am IN it. As the girl. I think she is dating multiple people as many of us are (because why commit to exclusive until there is really promise of a future and a deep connection). But, in this day and age it takes more time to find that connection and yet we are all sleeping with each other far too early! I do not think sex is a big deal, intimacy is but sex is not. However, there is a great amount of respect involved. And quality men do not want to be dating a girl who is sleeping with multiple people if they are really looking for commitment. So, how do you remain respectful of a man with potential while still dating other men (where pressure to have sex quickly may be involved) without out and out lying about your sexlife if asked?

    This girl is just trying to be respectful, take it slow, have her boundaries. She is trying to balance dating multiple men without being construed as easy or a whore. And she is having trouble doing it. It sounds to me like her cancellations and her making him wait on scheduling is because she is waiting on some other guys’ response to an invite already extended.

    She does also seem to have a bit of an issue getting out of the house. Perhaps she is embarrased to be dating this man.

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    • Paula Says:

      If the woman is a whore…what does that make Greg? He slept with her too. We know nothing about her sexual practices other than she slept with Greg once, and is not comfortable doing it again, but even if we did, the use of the word “whore” is simply not appropriate.

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    • Crotch Rocket Says:

      “quality men do not want to be dating a girl who is sleeping with multiple people” So, um, don’t tell them. Quality guys will likely be doing the same, but they know better than to talk about it–or ask you if you are.

      “how do you remain respectful of a man with potential while still dating other men (where pressure to have sex quickly may be involved)” If there is “pressure” from any of those men, they’re not ones you’d want a relationship with anyway; there is no need to be respectful because they’re not respecting you.

      “without out and out lying about your sexlife if asked?” Don’t ask, don’t tell. If you’re not in a committed relationship, there is no obligation to share that (or any other) information.

      “This girl … is trying to balance dating multiple men without being construed as easy or a whore.” Unless she charged him for the sex, she should have no worries about being construed as a whore. If being thought “easy” is a concern, she shouldn’t have slept with the OP on the second date; there’s nothing that can be done about that now.

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  10. andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

    Slow it down :

    And quality men do not want to be dating a girl who is sleeping with multiple people if they are really looking for commitment. So, how do you remain respectful of a man with potential while still dating other men (where pressure to have sex quickly may be involved) without out and out lying about your sexlife if asked?

    And the man would know about the woman’s multiple partners…how again?

    The answer to this non-quandry is simple. You lie if asked if you’re sleeping with anyone else and you practice safe sex. Men don’t usually ask such questions anyway. They don’t want to know because it opens up the conversation and the finger will then be pointed back at them. If it’s that important to you not to lie, then don’t sleep with any of them men you’re juggling.

    And what’s with using the word “whore?” I just don’t get it. How is this woman a “whore?” because she’s having sex, potentially with more than one person. Jesus. Come on.

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    • Slow it down Says:

      Thanks. I appreciate your viewpoint. (Please see below my apologies about whore – it was misinterpreted) Honestly not sure how I feel about lying or not. Partially – who cares – men are probably telling white lies to protect themselves too.

      But not having sex (when that eventuality comes around – haven’t had to face multiple partner problem yet) is not an option. Sex is an extremely important part of a compatible relationship (outside of those couples who agree that it is not, based on their faith). For me it is.

      PS. I have been directly asked by more than one man. And I have only been back on the market 3 months. :D

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  11. Trouble Says:

    I don’t have sex with people outside of an exclusive relationship, so there is no lying involved for me. In other words, I only have sex with one man, after I’ve determined (on the basis of several dates) that he’s someone with whom I would want to pursue a longer relationship. I find it is less emotionally complicated that way.

    I’m pretty open, up front, about that, with the guys I’ve dated. And, I don’t meet them in my house, where it seems like there is undue pressure to have sex. I pay for half of the dates as we gradually get to know each other, so no one feels like he is carrying an unfair load.

    That’s how I keep it simple.

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  12. Cricri Says:

    I can understand what that women is going through. Now she must have a lot on her mind like regretting sleeping with the guy so fast when “dating theory” says no to give up the goods easily, wondering what the guy is thinking of her, wondering what type of guy he is for sleeping so fast himself, wondering if backtracking might actually help salvage the situation. So there is a lot going on on the emotional side.
    Then, what caught my attention the most, is that she’s not making serious efforts to meet the guy out of her place. I don’t even know why they’re already having dates at each other’s place when they’ve only been on 2/3 dates max; that’s, first not safe at all, then you don’t even know if you actually like that guy so why bring him in your interior? 3rd, it is confusing as it gives the wrong message that the relationship progressed when it is not truly the case. Visibly those two don’t know each other. They need to actually date, not have some pretext for sex. I agree that being in each other’s place doesn’t equal sex but you also should be careful of who and when to bring people in your house. I can see why the guy is confused about the situation but it is not to the extent that once sex has happened on a 2nd there is such a precedent that taking things slow is a crazy idea. The OP should just take his time to know her and observe if she’s making efforts to meet him out of her place at first, and tell her what your opinion on the situation is as well. Whether or not she is aware of it, it will make for good communication between you two and if it doesn’t work out, then so be it.

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    • Crotch Rocket Says:

      “wondering if backtracking might actually help salvage the situation.” That never helps “salvage” the situation. At most, it just transforms one mess into a completely different mess.

      “not to the extent that once sex has happened on a 2nd there is such a precedent that taking things slow is a crazy idea.” Ah, but once you’ve had sex, “taking things slow” is code for “going backwards”. See above. When a guy sees a potential relationship going backwards, he’s going to bail–regardless of what his interest might have been before the woman started playing games.

      You cannot un-ring a bell.

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      • Cricri Says:

        Yeah, but I would hardly qualify that situation as a relationship since they have been on 2 dates and 2 dates don’t a relationship make. It’s not like they date for 3 months and out of nowhere she wants to take a break. I think that guy understands that they’re not in a relationship yet, but merely trying to figure out if they can be in one!

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      • Crotch Rocket Says:

        “they’re not in a relationship yet,” That’s why I said “potential relationship”.

        “but merely trying to figure out if they can be in one!” If a guy sees a girl playing these games, there’s no figuring needed: the answer is “no”.

        Having sex on the second (or tenth) date sets a precedent. That doesn’t mean you have to have sex on every date after that, but you also don’t get to go back to never having sex for some indefinite amount of time. It just doesn’t work that way.

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      • Jay_D2 Says:

        >You cannot un-ring a bell.

        I disagree. Yes, if a woman wants to backtrack, it shows she may have some problems in her head related to sex, or self-control, or decision-making. But people are human, sometimes they slip in self-control. If she seems ok in other respects, I would take a step back, keep dating her without sex, and wait to see how it goes. Is she crazy? Does she have sexual hang-ups? Is she playing games?

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  13. dimplz Says:

    I think the woman the OP is dating has to figure out within herself what she wants before she starts unloading her crap on him. Before my guy and I started dating, I made up my mind about whether or not I was comfortable having sex. He also mentioned he was uncomfortable with it because of our beliefs. If anything, it seems she wants to do it but is afraid of how he will look at her. This is her issue to deal with, but she’s laying it at his feet. Also, my bf and I try to avoid temptation so we go out a lot and have dinner or take a walk or go shopping. We know what leads to temptation, so if she doesn’t want it to get to that point, she has to change her surroundings. It’s unrealistic to think they’re going to sit on their hands all night when they are both alone in an apartment.

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    • Crotch Rocket Says:

      “If anything, it seems she wants to do it but is afraid of how he will look at her.” So she has sex with him, despite being afraid it will make her look “easy”, but then backtracks and won’t have sex with him again, which will definitely make her look crazy? How can any woman possibly see this strategy working out for her?

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  14. Aldonza Says:

    My gut on this one? Her on-again/off-again previous lover is sniffing around again. She went forward too fast in a new relationship and now she regrets it and she’s doing damage control. I don’t think she regrets it for the slut factor. Her reticence about hanging out outside the apartment is a flag for me. As well as leaving time open to decide to meet with you later. To me, that means that she’s hoping someone else will claim the time.

    Simple rule: if it sounds like an excuse…it probably is.

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  15. Eve Says:

    some people.

    She may think she slept with you too soon and is now looking to get to know you better. Why is this so difficult for people to get before accusing her of lying, a split personality disorder.
    It seems she likes you but she may feel it’s moved a litle too fast for her. My guess is if you continue your level of interest she’ll come round, back off and she class you as another one of those guys who are only after one thing.

    Try talking about it without accusing her of witholding etc & see what the issue is.

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  16. Kaybee Says:

    I agree w/ Aldonza .

    This woman is playing w/ Greg. Give me a break. She said she doesn’t want it to be about sex, yet 1) she slept with him on the second date? How does that action translate to “I don’t want it to be about sex” and even if it was a “mistake” why continually string this guy along and tell him ” have your schedule open” as to accomodate her to meet her back at her apt anyway since she doesn’t appear to want to go outside?? She’s shady. My gut instinct is 1) she didn’t enjoy the sex and/or 2) She’s involved in another relationship with someone else/ just exited a relationship with someone else/ or exploring her options with other men. 3) She ‘s playin him like a puppet. Bottom line: If she is remotely diggin ‘ you as much as you like her and ” not shady”, she would give you some respect and be upfront instead of giving BS excuses. If anything, continue to date other women until she can get emotional stability and figure out what the heck she wants from a relationship.

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  17. Greg Says:

    Hi, it’s Greg… thanks for chiming in everyone.

    I didn’t read every comment, but there was one that stated I should try to show her we can do things outside of the bedroom. It’s not as if I haven’t tried… because I have. Making our schedules match is remotely complicated, but an effort has definitely been made.

    Also, I didn’t mention this in my email, but at one point she did say, “I’ve already broken my normal rule of not having sex before the 10th date.” My jaw almost dropped. At the rate it took us to have four dates, 10 may have taken a good three or four months…

    And to be clear, I haven’t slept with anyone else since we started sleeping together, but to be frank… if a female wants it to stay that way she can’t play this little games.

    Thanks again for weighing in.

    Greg

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    • Cricri Says:

      10th date rule broken??? That is straight up retarded! First, if you have any smart at all, you don’t show your cards that way or at all! That would be the equivalent of a guy telling a girl ” I don’t generally date women like you, but I’m willing to break my rule! ” WTF! Who would stand for this? Not me and not you! She’s not making you a favor by sleeping with you, she should do it because she enjoys it. You might want to “next” that one.

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    • Vox Says:

      She’s a lying game player. Women who don’t have sex until the 10th date don’t accidentally have sex on the 2nd. (and I’m guessing she invented that 10th date rule after watching an episode Cougartown.) Time to move on… after all, don’t you want to be with a woman who can’t get enough you after you’ve been intimate?

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    • Kaybee Says:

      Greg,

      Man I think you just answered your own question. “if a female wants it to stay that way she can’t play this little games.” <—— Isn't this the point? Think about it. You've gone on 3 dates and you have all this drama. Ask yourself will it likely change and get better, not!! That's your gut telling you move on to the next woman. Don't waste anymore of your time on someone that doesn't give you the time of day. You are worth more than that. Good luck! Peace.

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    • dimplz Says:

      I’m always wary of arbitrary rules. If anyone puts a number on intimacy, they are fooling themselves and want some sense of control. I’m starting to side with Moxie – this isn’t about morals or respect, it’s about control.

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    • Jay_D2 Says:

      Yeah, that supposedly breaking a 10-date rule, combined with her being non-committal about making plans…sounds like she’s playing a game. Well, if you enjoy a diversion, and aren’t paying much (or anything) for her share of the dates, keep hanging-out with her, see what you learn and what happens, otherwise toss her.

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  18. andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

    “I’ve already broken my normal rule of not having sex before the 10th date.”

    I absolutely laughed out loud. See, she was telling you how much effort she was making and how she was a compromising herself for you so that you’d feel more indebted/guilty and wouldn’t push her for more than she’s capable of giving. That way the relationship could stretch out for literally months before you realize she brings nothing to the table.

    Jesus. Tell her I have a guy she’d LOVE to date. Their relationship would be the Passive Aggressive Olympics.

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  19. DrivingMeNutes Says:

    I’ve dealt with women like this before and learned a few lessons. My opinion is that she’s likely not deliberately “playing a game.” Most likely she is dating and/or having sex with someone else and has literally convinced herself that she is not. To her, each new partner is an “aberration” from her “norm” of exclusivity. That’s my guess, though it could be she’s deliberately manipulating.

    Anyway, this is a self-esteem issue. Mostly hers. Women like this will tie you in knots trying to convince them that you’re not “just in it for sex” when, the truth is, sex is probably pretty important to you. Why do you have to do deny it? And, you can’t really debate with a person like this because, due to their poor self-image, everything you say will be construed in bad faith — either as a desire to trick her into bed, or as a lack of interest on your part. In other words, you can’t win by debating. And, there’s no point in trying to figure out whether she’s doing it on purpose.

    So, the best solution really, in my view, is to walk away and say nothing. It’s possible that she will be left wondering why you left and make an effort to get you back. Or, it’s possible she will think you’re a bad guy who just wanted sex, as Paula said. Ok, so let her think that. In my experience, these girls often come back to you. Unfortunately, they tend to do so in a somewhat weakened state so it will never be as good or as fun as that second date.

    If you really, really want to discuss things with her, as some others have suggested, I would tell her only this: It’s not JUST about sex — nothing is — BUT sex is important to me and if the fact that we had sex is going to be an issue for you, then I”m just not sure we’re on the same page about it. So, let’s just be friends. Again, it’s possible she won’t let you go that easy. Just don’t get drawn into a debate about it. Act like you’re perfectly happy walking away (and be willing to if she wants to fight.)

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  20. Anonymous Says:

    I think that the girl’s reasoning here is bs for a very simple reason. If a guy is staying around after sex, he’s by definition not just after sex, especially if he makes efforts to accommodate that. In fact, most women who share that fear about men talk about not wanting a guy to disappear after he has screwed them. (as in calling back after sex at all). OP did way beyond that. Good luck convincing her.

    A better question is why OP is staying? Because of all her game, I get the sense that he is becoming less inclined to stay because he likes her and more inclined to stay because of the energy he has put into making it work (we always justify to ourselves why we make our decisions)

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    • chuckrock Says:

      this is an excellent point. but if you decide that you are staying because you like her, i would have the convo close to that which dmn suggests except not saying that you’ll leave; just that sex is important in a relationship and going backwards would only harm the relationship. if she isnt or isnt willing to be on the same page then she obviously doesnt want a relationship with you.

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  21. Ken Says:

    It’s very simple Chump; because that is what you are wasting your time on her), she is dating another guy. Here is the real story: She is dating you & at least one other guy. She thought things with guy #1, (in case your not aware your #2), were going no where so she puts her energies into you. Then guy #1 reenters the picture & she thinks shit I already started having sex with guy #2, what do I do now? What she did is put you on ice with her pull back from sex. The 2nd clue & most telling is she then makes you wait until her potential plans for the next night with guy #1 are confirmed. A decent person if she was interested in you would have either said no & then offered up her reason why, or explained her reason for not comiting to reassure you of her interest in you. RUN!

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    • Vox Says:

      I think you nailed it. As I’ve said before, the average emotionally healthy woman will not have sex with multiple men within the same time frame. We don’t fuck Bill on Tuesday, then Mike on Wednesday, then Frankie on Thursday. The exceptions are emotionally damaged (or perhaps are so healthy and secure about it they don’t feel the need to discuss it). The OP is on th B list for this gal.

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      • Paula Says:

        I still think it’s a major leap of logic #fail to say that being healthy and secure about *anything* means that you can’t talk about it.

        Some are so emotionally closed off and isolated from others that they don’t talk about anything with anybody, but that doesn’t mean their behavior (or inability to discuss it) is healthy.

        Some of us think aloud, whether it’s through dialogue with friends or anonymous vetting on blogs. I joke, because I’m a major packrat that still carries several suitcases when I travel, that I have plenty of baggage, but try to keep it on the outside. But it really is a life philosophy — if I’m living it out in the open, I’m much more comfortable about it than when I’m too embarrassed or conflicted to share it with anyone.

        Without getting into a definition of bragging (which often means the braggart has something the listener wants) there’s a difference between bragging and discussion. And since we just got rid of “don’t ask don’t tell” on a national level, it’s certainly not worth reinstating on a blog where we’re all adults posting anonymously.

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    • Slow it down Says:

      Thank you! That is exactly what I was trying to say. But also sort of supporting the idea that it is not easy to be newly single and want to see what options are out there without getting into these potentially awkward situations (she could have handled it better FOR SURE).

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  22. andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

    Vox :

    I think you nailed it. As I’ve said before, the average emotionally healthy woman will not have sex with multiple men within the same time frame. We don’t fuck Bill on Tuesday, then Mike on Wednesday, then Frankie on Thursday. The exceptions are emotionally damaged (or perhaps are so healthy and secure about it they don’t feel the need to discuss it). The OP is on th B list for this gal.

    An average emotionally healthy person doesn’t have sex with three different partners in three days. That’s sex addict territory. But 3 different people in 3 weeks? Sure, why not? I don’t think that makes someone emotionally damaged. If they’re not talking about it, then you wouldn’t really now how common it is, would you? So I’m not sure you can make that kind of broad generalization.

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    • Anonymous Says:

      If you think about it is it really the love of sex that would compel someone to have sex with 3 guys in a short time period or the need of hey I got 3 guys on the hook and jumping through hoops for me because I’m dangling the sex lure. There are also those with childhood trauma where their boundaries were so severely compromised they don’t know how to enforce them properly in their adult years.

      From a female point of view your odds of the sex being any good go up with one guy 3 times in a row then 3 times with someone new. Variety means zilch to a chick (the only use for variety would be if the first guy was terrible beyond hope) That seems like a severe lack of patience or self esteem issues to me.

      As for the braggarts. Well some people just like to shout into the wind and it doesn’t matter if you get positive or negative feedback just as long as you are heard. Also people will always justify their own choices as being normal while berating everyone else’s without being objective of themselves.

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      • Paula Says:

        Anonymous :

        From a female point of view your odds of the sex being any good go up with one guy 3 times in a row then 3 times with someone new. Variety means zilch to a chick (the only use for variety would be if the first guy was terrible beyond hope) That seems like a severe lack of patience or self esteem issues to me.

        Uh, no. Not all “chicks” view things in the same way. Variety is the spice of life, and it’s hard to replicate the excitement of being with someone for the very first time. Besides, isn’t it the guys around here who are saying that decent sex with one woman is pretty much the same as another?

        That doesn’t mean I (or other women) are incapable of deepening a relationship with someone and having the sex improving over time, or that we have major self-esteem issues. But it’s certainly possible that all three guys are not just another notch on the bedpost.

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      • Jay_D2 Says:

        Paula :
        Besides, isn’t it the guys around here who are saying that decent sex with one woman is pretty much the same as another?

        It depends upon on how many Kegel exercises she does
        ;)

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      • Vox Says:

        Whoops I guess I did mention sex addiction. guess I was thinking about a specific person. ;)

        And Paula, you’ve just old us on another thread that you don’t get to choose the men you are with, they choose you due to weight, age, etc, you are left with the dregs. Sorry, I’m not buying your sexual empowerment bs after reading that. You have none, and have to sleep with whoever will have you. They are probably far more attractive than men who’d actually date you, because men don’t mind stepping WAY down to get laid. Nothing wrong with this per se… It’s your life, and as such that’s fine… but don’t come here and try to convice anyone that you are healthy and empowered when guys fuck you, when you’ve admitted you have no power when it comes to your dinner date.

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      • Paula Says:

        Vox…way to twist my words and personally attack me at the same time. You must have really enjoyed that opportunity.

        You yourself have said that you should only date men who find you hot. You explained yourself on that topic several times, in that you shouldn’t spend time trying to make something work with someone who just isn’t that into you. You have also said that women over 40 have more challenges when it comes to finding someone to date. (My post wasn’t referencing me personally so much as women in my age cohort, but you were so determined to attack me that you couldn’t even recognize it when I agreed with you.)

        So, my personal approach is not to settle for the dregs when it comes to dating, or be in relationships that don’t work for me, even if it means that I am single for a longer period of time. However, I am not willing to be celibate until I find that special someone, so I’m not.

        Sure, the league to find someone to sleep with is a different one…so effin what! That’s hardly a newsflash. I have slept with those with whom I could never see myself in a relationship…for a lot of very valid and legitimate reasons. Sometimes, I sleep with someone who could never see themselves in a relationship with me…for a lot of valid and legitimate reasons, not the least of which is the lack of a strong attraction. Again…so? This isn’t news.

        I’m finally getting back into the actual dating scene…and have four dates this week. I’ve already made plans for a second with one of them; one of them neglected to disclose that he was married and looking for a polyamorous thing (there won’t be a second.) Who knows what will happen on the next two?

        For a long time, my self-esteem was so low that I did settle for the dregs. That’s why I ended up in a bad marriage, and a rebound relationship that wasn’t ultimately satisfying, because I believed no one else would want me.

        If you’re looking to a relationship to give you self-esteem, you’re looking in the wrong place. If you’re looking to sex to give you self-esteem, you’re looking in the wrong place. But approaching either with your eyes open and your self-esteem intact, and knowing what you want and making your decisions accordingly, well, that can be more empowering than anything, regardless of the outcome.

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    • Crotch Rocket Says:

      “An average emotionally healthy person doesn’t have sex with three different partners in three days. That’s sex addict territory.” Would you call someone a “bowling addict” if they bowled with three different partners in three days? Or even on the same day? You are defining “emotionally healthy” as someone who attaches the same emotional baggage to sex that you do, which is hardly objective.

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      • Paula Says:

        It’s like the definition of promiscuity: someone who has sex more than you do.

        And hooray, bowling is back!

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      • Vox Says:

        No I wouldn’t (I didn’t use the term “sex addict” by the way… I have strong ideas about sex addiction, but they have nothing to do with this thread.) Sex with three different men in the same day isn’t the same thing as bowling with three different men in the same day. We aren’t men, sex is different for us. Women who have sex with three different men within the same day will lie about it by omission if they meet a man they feel is relationship material. because even they know how damaged thy are, even if they won’t admit it straight up.

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  23. VJ Says:

    Yep. I thinks there’s many different interpretations possible here. Most if not all not very complimentary too. The best option for the OP is to simply walk away. If he wants to be a gentlemen, he might offer a simple explanation. ‘Things were confusing, so you’ll have time to figure it all out…’. But I’d not wait by the phone either.

    Crazy is as crazy does, and if there’s no viable explanation forthcoming from her? Nothing doing & nothing’s moving forward. She’s now claiming for herself that she’s Suddenly incapable of an fully adult intimate relationship. That’s fine. You need to move on then. You might even be friendly about it perhaps. But Imagine you might be married to someone who suddenly ‘cuts off sex’ (‘marriage is So much more than that’!), and then that’s that. You’re involuntarily celibate for a few years. Until you discover her other paramours. Or the inevitable divorce comes through. Not a good scenario, right? Why tolerate someone who’s telling you up front that they’re fully capable of such behavior right out of the box?

    But the oldest game in the book is the old ‘push me pull me’ deal with sex. If an adult woman of otherwise seemingly sound mind & body is pulling these games over the age of 25-30 say? Without, like Really detailed explanations, some of them involving prior bodily injury perhaps? Then she’s playing games for some reason, and trying to be manipulative for some end. Which is not only counterproductive, but certainly sub-optimal as a LTR material for anyone. Or even an ‘adult’ friendships. Other than that? It really speaks to and sounds an awful lot like HS sex access games, and in this day & age? Who needs such juvenile nonsense? And most likely she’s got someone on the side too. So let him/them pick up the slack! You don’t need their or her troubles. Cheers, ‘VJ’

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  24. Ken Says:

    Having been there & married to a woman who used access to her vagina as a method of control I can sniff out these women like a beagle on a jack rabbit! When I meet one of them I RUN & never look back. I dated a woman post divorce for 11 months before this behavior surfaced. I split like an amoeba, she is still trying to get me back, I have & will continue to say NFW!!! I am not an animal or addicted to sex. I am actually very understanding & tender. If a woman puts me off for sex it is in the best interest of the relationship that she comes to me, preferably in the morning, definitely asap, and make love to me like she hasn’t had it in years!

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  25. Paula Says:

    Vox :
    Women who have sex with three different men within the same day will lie about it by omission if they meet a man they feel is relationship material. because even they know how damaged thy are, even if they won’t admit it straight up.

    No, women will lie about it because of judgmental people like you who want them to feel damaged, or because they’ve listened to their parents, friends, and religious advisors for too long. Or, they’ll lie about it because they’ve previously encountered men with madonna/whore complexes who won’t consider someone for a relationship that has an extensive sexual history. Or, they’ll say nothing, and the man will never know, and enough of them will appreciate her lack of sexual inhibition enough to not really think too closely about how that came about.

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  26. marci Says:

    you should definetly try to talk to her openly and tell her how you feel and think and then see if she is understanding and whether anything changes. if not- then you can leave in peace knowing that you acted like a decent human being. which is how you should be acting if you want to be treated as such, especially with a potential girlfriend.

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  27. Slow it down Says:

    Apologies for everyone misinterpreting how I was using the word “whore”. I do not think the poster is a whore or that any woman engaging in a healthy and active sex life is a whore. I was using it as an example of how portions of society or men that feel burned may sometimes decide to view a woman that way and speak of her as such. It was not reflective of my personal views.

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  28. M Says:

    Jay_D2 :
    >She is quite obviously the kind of girl who puts out on the second date, as evidenced by doing so with the OP. It’s that simple. And there’s nothing inherently wrong with that.
    Well…I think when people write that, what they really mean is “she really isnt the kind of girl who [normally/has ever/etc] puts out on the 2nd date.”

    Yes, that’s what I meant. Obviously.

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  29. MG Says:

    Oh yeah…this is when they’re using US for sex…I get a lot of week-long 4-6x per night(literally all night on weekends) stands, then they start that ‘I don’t know what I really want’ bullshit. Many of them are getting too comfortable. A lot of deep conversation, though, understanding…I could actually see myself with some of them for life(I’m 34 and a professional athlete)but no… I just leave, block their number… As soon as that crap happens, I’m out. You all should do the same thing, big deal if it’s perfect, you feel used. And no matter how many times it happens, that’s the way it works. She got what she wanted, you were just some really good fling, now she can say she did that. No matter how satisfied and comfortable she gets, it can happen, it’s a whole new age of dating.

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