Beware The Hustler

Here’s an interesting story:

I met K. online earlier this year. I contacted him. He is an actor, 40 and “lived” in Brooklyn. We met once for drinks. Kiss good night at the end of the date and nothing more. He said he wanted to go out again and made tentative plans for the following weekend. I didn’t hear from him again after that and figured HJNTIM

A couple months later his profile popped up in my Activity feed. He had changed his location to Massachusetts. I did not contact him. A few months later I get an email from him through the website. His location had changed back to NYC. He never mentioned our date and neither did I. We made small talk and then he asked if I wanted to go out again. I said yes. We met for drinks a few nights later. He told me that he hadn’t been with a woman in a very long time because he was still getting over a break up from the year before. (?) He walked me home and asked to come upstairs with me. I said no because I had had a couple drinks and thought I would fall asleep. (That was the mostly truth.)  He stays in touch daily after that. He said he had to go home for a week but that he wanted to get together again when he got back. We make a date for the night after he gets back. A few hours before our date he emails me to tell me how excited he is to see me and how, if it was okay with me, he’d like to stay over.

I canceled the date.

Here’s why:

First off, the fact that he changed his location on his profile was odd. Changing it back a few months later was even more strange. I’ve said before that I don’t like dating transitional guys. Guys who are in between apartments, couch surfing, newly divorced/broken up, etc. To me, his living situation seemed too unstable. I still went out with him because I didn’t have the full story and figured I’d unravel the mystery eventually. As long as I wasn’t being asked to spend money on him or carry him in some capacity, I was okay with getting to know this guy.

Next was his sob story on the second date about how he hadn’t been with anyone in a while due to his past break up. Uh huh. As I said last week (and that post was partly inspired by this situation) someone who makes such a confession is either socially clueless or being strategic. Really? An above average looking guy of 40 living in NYC can’t get laid? Please. A comment like that is meant to lull the recipient into a false sense of security. Yes. I’m so sure that I’m different. Something about me makes this man want to peek his head out from under that shell and rejoin the word. Yeesh. How do women not smell that a mile away?

The third nail in the coffin was his request – before the date – to stay over. Now, I only  invite a man up to my apartment if both I plan on sleeping with him and feel comfortable with the possibility that he might stay over. Sorry, but to kick someone out after that is rude. If the guy wants to leave, that’s fine, but I would never ask someone to leave.

All along, my Spidey Senses were tingling about this guy. That growing hesitation was enough for me to pull the plug. I didn’t have to set any traps or Google stalk him. A little critical thinking goes a long way.

I replied to his email and told him that I didn’t feel comfortable having him stay over and wished him luck. He replied and said he was really looking forward to hanging out. I didn’t respond. No damage done.

My gut feeling was that this guy was more looking for a place to crash than anything else. I happen to know of a guy who does something similar, only he actually lives with his GF. He doesn’t pay rent, she takes him away with her on trips, usually pays his bar tabs, etc. He’s constantly crying poor though he recently started his own business. We recently gave me a sob story about how a client owed him a ton of money and that he had to go to a b-day party “where he couldn’t even afford to drink.” Um, stay home? It felt suspiciously like a request for a loan. I never replied to his email.

I don’t care how a guy supports himself. He just has to support himself. And, preferably, lives on his own if he’s over 30, but that is somewhat negotiable. I don’t care if he supports himself off an inheritance or investments or savings. Though I would prefer that he be doing something productive, even volunteering, with his time. It’s one thing to take some time off because you came into some money. I don’t think I could do that long term, for say more than a few months. I’d go crazy.

I could never date someone who wasn’t in some way pulling their weight or who was living off the hard work of other people.

Yet there are plenty of people who effortlessly and shamelessly do just that. The guy from my first story is likely cruising that website looking to cultivate a group of women to date so that, when he gets acting gigs in the city, he has a place to stay. My guess is he actually lives in Massachusetts and comes here for acting jobs. Swell. Get a shoebox apartment in East Harlem for $600, get a second job like every other actor on the planet, and pay your way.

People like this – and they come in both the male and female variety – are Hustlers. They basically leech off other people rather than pay their own way. They comprise a big part of the underbelly of dating in a big/expensive city that attracts dreamers and breeds spoiled rich kids.

Beware.

 

 

 

 

 

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28 Responses to “Beware The Hustler”

  1. Trouble Says:

    I think your spidey senses remain solid. Do a search on “vulnerability PUA game.” His comment about not having been with anyone in a while since his breakup was classic vulnerability game designed to engage your maternal instincts and make you feel like he was being open and vulnerable to you. Game, with a twist.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1

  2. Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

    Sometimes it’s game. Sometimes it’s just bad movie dialogue. :)

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0

    • Howard Says:

      Your instincts are dead on! And guess what, most guys are dead on too, when they refuse to go on the date with that girl who changes the script too. The same can be said for dinner whores also. Now let’s be sure to note, that I am not calling all women dinner whores, because this is always the typical spin that comes back at the guy who even mentions that phrase, “dinner whore”.

      Freeloaders, flaky people, and suspicious people are always problematic, irregardless of gender.

      Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0

  3. GuyDatingAbroad Says:

    In my experience, people like this are not so common in dating. When they are, we can spot them and cut bait… unless they are so hot that good judgment goes out the window. Otherwise kudos to you for giving him a chance to show otherwise, and then cutting bait when he did not show he was someone better.

    Moxie, I am impressed that you are doing all the positive things in giving dates a chance, like being open minded and non-judgmental, going with the flow, and not being stuck up with lists. Practicing what you are preaching.

    On the other hand, I am perplexed that after all these years practicing good dating, you have not been able to find a long term steady relationship. Is it because a vast majority of guys turn out to have some major issues, like this guy? Or maybe my definition of long term steady relationship is different. That in fact, you are successful, it’s just long term is not marriage or exclusive for many years?

    This question applies to other people experiencing the same. Just wondering what gives?

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 2

    • Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

      I am perplexed that after all these years practicing good dating, you have not been able to find a long term steady relationship.

      I haven’t been practicing good dating all these years. I would say that I didn’t hit my dating stride until probably last year. But that came after several years of starting from a serious deficit emotionally and interpersonally.

      By the time I really got it together, I was in my forties. And the reality is, that’s just too late if your true goal is to settle down and/or get married. That’s why I get so annoyed listening to some of the women here pontificate. Sorry, your days of being so opinionated and still being attractive to men are pretty much gone. Time to Plan B it. So I Plan B’d it. I’m still open to meeting someone for a long term relationship. I’m just not banking on it. So now I’m dating casually and just enjoying it. I think if I had truly wanted to be married, I could have been, as I can do anything if determined. I just wasn’t determined enough.I prioritized other things. Some were productive, some weren’t.

      Women in my age bracket (38+) waste so much time trying to change the past instead of just accepting it and accepting their role in it and moving forward and maximizing the options they do have. They get to the point where they can not confront the fact that they are still single because the made certain choices or have major personality flaws/defects. That is the reason. They can re-write it all the like, but that is why they are 38, 40, 42 and still single. And until they accept their choices and their contribution to the outcome, they’ll not only stay that way but continue to struggle.

      Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 19 Thumb down 2

      • GuyDatingAbroad Says:

        Thank you for sharing that.

        Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

      • Joey Giraud Says:

        I’m sure that living in NYC doesn’t help matters. The ratio is what, like 2 to 1?

        Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

      • Gorb Says:

        This is remarkably straightforward and honest. You really like to cut through the hamster-wheel of rationalization.

        Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

        • Gorb Says:

          And living in NYC is a killer.

          I’m telling you: smaller cities are where it’s at for your demographic. NYC is a decaying cesspool of whores, semi-whores, unadmitted whores and players, among both sexes.

          It’s pickup time. The whole NYC vibe is toxic poison for serious dating.

          Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0

  4. John Says:

    “To me, his living situation seemed too unstable. I still went out with him because I didn’t have the full story and figured I’d unravel the mystery eventually”

    Surprised you didn’t ask about profile location changes while he was waiting for your reply to the sleepover question. You had a captive audience and he would be forced to address it. You had nothing to lose since you already decided he was not a keeper.

    Geez now we have to add hustlers to the list of time wasters, attention seekers, bad daters, entitlement people, stalkers and drama queensi. I need a flowchart to keep track of all the red flags associated with each type.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0

    • nathan Says:

      This guy has some question marks for sure. What I have noticed though is that everyone is treated as being suspect around here. Red flag is essentially a meaningless term when almost no one is upheld as being decent enough to date. Constantly picking people apart is a great way to remain single.

      Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1

  5. Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

    You had a captive audience and he would be forced to address it.

    He probably would have lied. That’s what disingenuous people do. That’s why asking such questions are pointless. People spend so much time trying to craft all their “trick” questions and thinking they can trap someone into revealing who they really are that they fail to listen to both what the other person is saying and to their own gut. People – especially disingenuous people – usually tell us exactly who they are. They just don’t realize it because they’re too busy trying to cover their ass.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0

    • Trouble Says:

      Plus, guys like that tend to be fairly polished liars. My ex-husband certainly was.

      If I’d been paying attention, as Moxie recommends, I’d have realized that much earlier. Your average scumbag has practice with being a scumbag. it’s a way of life for them. Those of us who aren’t liars probably aren’t going to be able to trap them in a lie. If we do, they’ll just lie their way out of the trap. It’s not about pinning that person down and forcing them to reveal the true story. It’s just about seeing their red flags and cutting them loose as early as possible.

      Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0

      • Trouble Says:

        And, not being the type of person who wants to be lied to. Some of us are so desperate to hear what we want to hear that we just make it too damn easy.

        Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

        • Joey Giraud Says:

          Isn’t it funny how quickly those people run away when they realize you’re not a sucker? The train never leaves the station.

          Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

      • Crotch Rocket Says:

        It’s not about pinning that person down and forcing them to reveal the true story.
        This. Too many people (mostly women, but a few men, in my experience) are obsessed with “winning” and getting the other person to “admit” what they did wrong, that they continue to subject themselves to bad behavior, get jaded and miss out on opportunities with people that won’t treat them badly.

        Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 0

  6. fuzzilla Says:

    There was an attractive, funny guy I was messaging with at one point. On OKC they have a sidebar of similar users. I noticed all his similar users lived in Seattle. I do not, and his profile said he lived in my town. I brought it up and was like “hey, what’s up with that?” He said “oh yeah, I’m just in town for a couple weeks for work and then I’m going back to Seattle.” We had some pleasant messages, never met, that was that. Just looking for some play when he was in town, I guess (but then why not just say that? I’ve seen plenty of profiles that do).

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

  7. Erine Says:

    What can be more sad and pathetic than a 40 y.o. Man without a job and a place to stay still seeing himself as a hot young thing who has all the time in the world.. I dont know about other women, but a hot model type man without stability would turn me off more than any other type.

    The society really has changed a lot and in terms of dating not for the good. Feminism is partially tp blame.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 2 Thumb down 10

    • Joey Giraud Says:

      There have been gigilos as long as there have been rich or powerful women. Feminism doesn’ t have anything to do with that.

      At age 21, I lived off my girlfriend for a year while playing in a rock band. What a great life! Too bad my taste in women doesn’t include suckers.

      Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1

      • Robyn Says:

        The thing is…. if the M.O. that a guy had in his 20’s still works in his 30’s, he has no incentive to do anything differently. And if it continues to work in his 30’s, come 40 he’ll still be working the same angle.

        Same thing goes for women too – it’s human nature in general – “if it still works, why change it?”.

        Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0

        • Crotch Rocket Says:

          “if it still works, why change it?”
          The problem is that, one day, it does stop working–and these people don’t realize it; if they do see it’s not working so well, they blame others for not being suckers anymore rather than their own behavior. In the rare cases where they do recognize the real problem, they don’t know how to change it because it’s what they’ve been doing their entire lives.

          Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

    • Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

      I dont know about other women, but a hot model type man without stability would turn me off more than any other type.

      You’d be shocked at how desperate some women are. The guy from the second story in this post has been pretty much unemployed for over 2 years and living with/off his gf. Before that he was living with his father. He’s almost 40, hasn’t held down a steady job in his life, is always broke…..yet she posts picture after picture of them on FB as though they’re a “typical” couple.Sad.

      Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

  8. Violet Says:

    If he didn’t already have some sense of where you lived, I kinda think it would have been cool if you had said, “Sure, definitely stay over. Let’s meet at Bar X at 7:30. I’m so excited to see you!” And then totally stand him up and don’t answer your phone. Stranded in NYC with no where to stay but a legit hotel.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 0 Thumb down 14

    • Crotch Rocket Says:

      Striking back is petty and, if you have any sort of conscience, going to hurt you more than it hurts them.

      The correct response to bad behavior, short of something criminal, is to simply remove that person from your life and move on.

      Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 0

  9. Ashley Says:

    At first I was thinking about how I have been in relationships with men who started out with some strange behavior and things turned out fine but after giving it some thought, I understand your suspicions here about him possibly being a couch surfer. I find it suspicious that he asked to stay at your place twice, and so soon. I have a history of problems with leeches. None were boyfriends of my own, thank goodness…but I once shared an apartment with my best friend and her boyfriend who was a leech. He literally did nothing but play video games and said he couldn’t get hired anywhere because he had a felony against him, which is true but he just didn’t try either. Instead he begged his gf to buy everything for him, and she did….and went into debt doing so and had to file bankruptcy because of it all which is how our unit there ended.

    After that, I have had 3 different sets of roommates who I have bad problems leeching. Either they slacked on helping to pay bills, forcing me to cover their part or deal with being evicted/getting the utilities shut off. I am currently in the process of moving because my roommates moved in family members against my will who needed a place to crash for free so they can support their weed habit. They promised me it was only temp, but after 2 months of them being here, I knew they weren’t trying to move out. The roommates aren’t kicked them out and the landlord couldn’t care less about the situation…so I’m decided to remove myself.

    So yeah, leeches are a huge pet peeve of mine. It’s not hard to support yourself. I don’t know why so many people try to scam their way into having other people pay their way for everything. It’s rather despicable.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0

  10. Joey Giraud Says:

    Don’t think of it as your lazy-bum actor boyfriend living off of your hard work……

    Think of it as supporting the arts!

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

  11. Robyn Says:

    Problem with coughing up for an out-of-work actor / wanna-be novelist is that none of it’s tax-deductible ;)
    At least if you donate to a foundation that supports artists / actors / singers / musicians while they’re trying to make it, your donation is tax-deductible. And quite often there are other bigger donors that will match contributions made by the pool of individual donors, so – in several ways – a donation is a lot more effective than spending the same amount of dollars feeding the fella on your couch.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0

  12. Hank Says:

    Jaded. Chronic Overanalyzer.

    Nuff Said. lol

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2

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