Question: This is more of a “request” for discussion than a dating question, as you already posted a dating question for me this week, so I feel a bit rude posting in here twice.
I like what you said to me on Twitter: “If he’s the type to think you’re easy, he’s still going to end up being a douche.”
Notice the progression of events here:
1) Guy X thinks you’re easy (WHORE), therefore..
2) Guy X treats you like crap.
This makes me want to reverse the whole thing (can you tell by now that I’m a PhD student studying rhetoric?)
1) Guy X thinks that you only sleep with Special Boyfriends (VIRGIN), therefore…
2) Guy X treats you like a Goddess.
Notice that in both scenarios, Guy X has the option to judge the woman and change his behavior based on that judgment. The woman, of course, has no power whatsoever.
I’m sure that’s not what you intended, but it does raise a fascinating issue for what I’m dealing with right now in the dating world:
I have a high sex drive. Very, very high. I enact it not only by being “easy” but also by being very giving, enthusiastic, and active in the bedroom. I tend to be pretty horny most of the time.
Sometimes I like to try to “land” a boyfriend who (hopefully) also has a high sex drive, but more often than not I like to sleep around. As you know, OKC and POF make this stupidly easy for most women to accomplish. So I’ve had eight different casual sex partners since March. Always with no expectation of romance or a relationship, but occasionally the guys insist. Seriously I think some men need dinner and a movie to get in the mood
Anywhoo, I’m now to a point where I’m “sated” and ready to settle down with a boyfriend. I have a viable candidate in mind, and I’ve already told him that I haven’t had sex since February… because that was the last time I was in a committed long term relationship.
The thing of it is, I don’t like that I have to lie about this. I hate the Virgin/Whore dichotomy, and I hate that I’m buying into it by lying to this guy. But you said it yourself – a woman can’t be considered “easy” by a man.
I’ve never met a man who was willing to treat a woman with respect once he knew that she had been promiscuous in the past. And yet if a guy tells me that he had a bunch of casual sex a couple months ago, but now is looking for something committed, I would be happy to treat him with respect, and I would applaud his decision.
Is there any way out of this “judgment” trap that society set for us 4000 years ago? Or are we forced to play this game? I’m interested in your thoughts.
Thanks for your time,
Before my friend left to go home for the holidays, we cracked open a bottle of wine and had the “So, what has your OKC experience been like?” talk. We weren’t comparing numbers as much as we were comparing notes. He shared that, in the handful of months he’d been on that site, all of the women he went out with a second time had either had sex with him on the first date or on the second date. (I didn’t ask how many here were. That wasn’t the point of the exercise.) The ones who waited for the second date all did the “you’re not coming home with me tonight” thing that many women like to do. They wouldn’t sleep with him on the first date because first date sex, in their mind, was “bad.” They waited until the second date because, most likely, they rationalized that if a guy sticks around after one date with no sex then he must be truly interested.
What they don’t understand is that if a man is the type to consider a woman easy for enjoying her sexuality, one date isn’t going to matter. These guys want the woman to wait a long time so that they (the men) don’t have to fear that they are just one of many. That has nothing to do with gauging the woman’s virtue. That is all about massaging the man’s ego.
What women don’t understand is that men know what we’re thinking. They know we’re afraid of being considered “slutty.” Like anything else, they go along with our rationalizations and explanations knowing that we’ll eventually put out. These men understand that were merely trying to buy ourselves time so we don’t look “slutty.” As I pointed out to my friend, these women – the ones who justify or qualify when they decide to have sex – usually go on to be far more trouble than they’re worth. Rather than own their own decisions and manage expectations, they project all of their insecurity onto the guy until things eventually implode.
I think that in the beginning of a relationship, both people need to keep their sexual history to themselves. Personally, I don’t find a man’s sexually history threatening. If my guy told me he had had a series of one night stands before we met, I wouldn’t care. I don’t want to know what he does after that point, of course. But hearing what happened before doesn’t faze me. I think a lot of this really depends on how the information is being shared. There’s something unseemly about a man or woman who brags about all the sex they have. It casts a rather sad light on the person doing the bragging. What’s funny is that if this information is shared publicly, like say on Twitter or a blog, the results are polar opposite depending on the braggarts gender.
A man can blog about all the sex he has and women will still want to be with him and try to date him seriously. Why? Because they like the idea of taming the beast and one upping the women who came before them. A woman, however, could not get away with it. She reeks of insecurity and sadness and ends up being passed around by various brahs who can’t be bothered to actually ask her out. Instead, she might get the last minute or late invite for drinks. She is considered a final option should no others arise. This is where things differ. A man can share his number and the woman will pretend to be intimidated or shocked, but she’s actually pleased that she’s found a man with so much experience. A woman could share her number and the man could be turned off. All of this hinges upon the security level of each person, of course. This is why I don’t advocate that these conversations be had. Ever.Frankly, I find the idea of counting or keeping track of lovers to be juvenile.
The only way out of this judgment trap is either to say nothing and never have this talk, lie or to only date men who have matured beyond the Madonna/Whore ideology. (Those men do exist, by the way. ) There is no logical explanation for why we even need to know about their sexual history beyond their last few test results. Numbers are inconsequential. We really aren’t entitled to know any of that. Whatever happened before you got with one partner should stay in the past out of respect for your partner. A story here or there isn’t an issue. More than that and you’re delving into “baggage” territory.