How Long Should You Wait For The Second Date?

Name: Scott
Age: 30
City: New York
State: NY
Comment: So I’ve decided to get back on the sauce and once again use a fairly popular, well-known internet dating website that’s free…Yes, I’ve been going out with a few women, with mixed success, and thankfully enjoying the experience for the most part without getting too exhausted and/or frustrated.

Last night, I was pleasantly surprised to have a first date which I initially thought wouldn’t go anywhere turn out to be excellent…instead of having the typical one round of drinks and calling it a night, we ended up having four rounds, and our conversation flowed smoothly as we opened up and got to know one another…as I got the sense that she was enjoying my company and somewhat into me, just as I was into her, I asked her if she would be interested in seeing me again.  I’m in my 30’s now; I’m not into the dating games and am fairly clear with my intentions, and she was in her mid-20’s and respected the fact that I’m a bit older and have my act together (for the most part).   She seemed receptive to getting together again, and I suggested getting together the upcoming weekend – we went out on a Wednesday night, so it seemed like an appropriate amount of time.

When she indicated the weekend was not looking good, I suggested the following week, and she seemed hesitant, and said she was pretty booked.  Now, I understand how someone can easily book 7 dates for each night of the week, and I’m not implying that she did that.  When she suggested that we meet a week and a half later, I mentioned something like, “I’m going to have to wait a week and a half to see you again?”  Keep in mind as well that she’s relatively new to the site, having signed up about a month ago, but she was the one who initially contacted me on the site.  After my comment, she checked her schedule again and she realized she was free on Tuesday, so we agreed on getting dinner that night.

However, I’m wondering what your thoughts are with respect to waiting too long for that second date…If she were to make me wait, let’s say a week and a half, when there was no discernible excuse like going out of town, studying for a test, etc. etc., then would that be too long to wait and a sign that she wasn’t really into me, as I had thought?  Do you think my comment about waiting a week and a half compelled her to “free” up a night, because she sensed I would lose interest?  What’s your take?

I generally feel like after a successful first date, barring any exigent circumstances, i.e. catering to out of town guests, out of town trips, heavy work loads, etc., you shouldn’t have to wait more than a week to see someone you’re interested in.   What say you?

 

My take is that she’s new to the site and probably, since she’s in her mid twenties, getting a lot of offers. I don’t think she’s any more interested in you than she would be any other guy she met on there.

Here’s the thing: when a woman is into a guy, she finds excuses to free her schedule. That’s it. She doesn’t tell a man she’s booked. That is, unless she’s trying to play hard to get and/or not terribly interested. She could have been trying to seem aloof and like she has options. I tend to think that women like this are more invested in the chase and the attention than anything else. Either way, her response doesn’t bode well for you.

I’m not sure if all of this back and forth happened the same night of your first date or what. If so, yikes. You came on pretty strong. If this whole conversation happened while you two were face to face after that first date, I’m thinking she felt kind of awkward and uncomfortable. If that’s the case, she might have agreed to see you Tuesday just to get away from you and planned on cancelling once she got home.

In the future, when a woman says she’s booked, just reply back and say, “No problem. Get back to me when you know your schedule.”  Don’t offer commentary like, “I have to wait a week and a half to see you again?” It just makes you seem overly invested and aggressive given you only had one date. Not only that but you really shouldn’t have to convince someone to want to see you again. That, too, is a bad sign. My guess is she wasn’t 100% psyched to go out with you again, was trying politely to get out of it, and you pushed a bit. That or her plans cancelled and she had nothing to do so she figured, “Why not?” I wouldn’t be surprised if you followed in the comments and told me that she cancelled on you. Like I said, if we like you, we make time for you. If she had been on the same page as you you wouldn’t have sensed hesitation. You would have sensed antici….pation. (Rocky Horror reference!)

I think a lapse of a week and a half after the first date ruins the momentum. There’s too much time between meetings for things to develop naturally. You want to be able to build on whatever attraction and compatibility is present in person, and rather soon. Suggesting to a date that you and they should get together again over the weekend following the first date sounds reasonable to me. I used to think that suggesting a second date within the next 2 or 3 days after the first date was too much, but that’s changed. Time is of the essence. If the connection and attraction is there, go for it. Within reason, of course. Don’t become all clingy and barrage them with texts, don’t suggest a date the next night,but do something to let your interest be known.

What was considered “too available” a few years ago doesn’t necessarily stand now because of how intense and fast the process of meeting and connecting has become.

Now, to touch on your distinction that she messaged you first and therefore that is an indicator of her interest level. You’re rationalizing. The online experience and the offline experience are two separate animals. Your profile is a one dimensional representation of who you are and nothing more. She probably sent a few messages to different men. I can assure you that her investment level was minimal, as it should be since she hadn’t even met you yet.

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68 Responses to “How Long Should You Wait For The Second Date?”

  1. Horace Says:

    Some dudes are emotionally dumb. Most dudes. They have no empathy, and thus no insight into what a woman’s feeling.

    “When a woman is into a guy, she finds excuses to free her schedule.” You spoke the gospel, Moxie. As a man, you’re not just competing against every other guy chatting her up on OkCupid, but also and more so against the EXCITEMENT SHE FEELS about all of those guys chatting her up on OkCupid. You have to be better than the thrill she gets from multiple guys hustling for her time. That’s tough, and takes your attention and your effort. If he (or any man) wants a woman to open up her schedule for him, he had better earn it. Or he can “just be himself” and end up having to send his sob story into a dating column.

    I’m in an online dating “upswing” currently. When a woman seems resistant and plays the “next week is so busy” card, I play it cool in a way that alludes to the fact that I have options, just like her. My standard line in that situation, word-for-word: “No worries. I’ll be patient, and hope that no one sweeps either of us off of our feet by then.” Then I’ll call her (NOT TEXT), midway through the week to reconnect.

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    • fuzzilla Says:

      >Some dudes are emotionally dumb. Most dudes. They have no empathy, and thus no insight into what a woman’s feeling.<

      I think this is very true; definitely true here. It really seems like his assessment that the date was so great was a lot of projection. Where's the evidence of her interest?

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  2. D'Alias Says:

    Or she could just be busy. She could have plans with friends, be going out of town, working, whatever. The canned lamenting about having to wait to see her is a huge turn off. Why are you demanding her time when you just met? Play it cool, my friend.

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    • fuzzilla Says:

      >The canned lamenting about having to wait to see her is a huge turn off.<

      Totally. Talk about a turd in the punch bowl.

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    • Jason Says:

      Play it cool. Although based on my experiences you MAY be correct, i dont like this play it cool game. Its fake. Why play it cool? Play it how you feel it just dont make the other person feel like they dont have space and cant breath. But definitly dont play anything. Im not saying to lamely just “Be yourself” im saying dont just play the cool fool who who lets some other guy dance with your girl. Go take your girl.

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  3. DevonMcNulty Says:

    My general view is that trying to set up a date the immediate weekend after a Wednesday first date is too soon. Even if you had no plans for the weekend, I think it makes you seem too available and/or lacing in impulse control which is a potential kiss of death for a man. I don’t agree with Moxie’s view that dating has changed in a way that requires rushing things – yes, she has many options. Women always do. And… always have. The key is to create the appearance that you have options too.

    Otherwise, I agree with Moxie’s advice that the proper response to a “booked” situation is to just play along and allow her to control the pace. You don’t need to know the answer if she’s “really” interested or not. Time will tell – I would check in with her, she will come around and reciprocate if she’s interested. Trying to guilt her into seeing you after one date is a very bad idea, in my opnion.

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  4. MichaelEsquandolas Says:

    I think it’s absolutely fine to see someone again a few days after a first date. In my view, its all in how you ask though. You don’t want to come off like you had nothing else going on or that you’re entirely freeing up your schedule to see this person again. You should have plans ready that you can mention. Something you were doing anyway that you can just invite her to rather than asking her out again. Its much more casual and less pressure. I like Horace’s line too. Prob start using that…

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  5. AnnieNonymous Says:

    Even though most people are cool with short meet-ups during the workweek, i don’t assume that anyone is going to be willing to go out on dates on a work night. Some people can seem overly fussy about never letting themselves stay out late if it’s not a weekend. It’s not weird in and of itself if someone you’ve just started dating can only see you once or twice a week in the beginning. It’s also not weird for that person to have to tie up a lot of loose ends before a relationship can fall into place. That includes fulfilling plans she made before you met her and dates that she already has on her roster. It’s curious that this guy doesn’t seem to have asked her about her work schedule or what she’s doing for the next two weekends. I don’t think I’ve ever come away from a first date not knowing when the guy gets home from work and the details of the fun things he’s doing over the weekend.

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    • Horace Says:

      The only legit reason to not be willing to meet up during the week (as a rule) is that you have kids. I’ve had first dates with two women recently who have kids and could only meet up on the weekend. And while there was chemistry and we’ll enjoy each other’s company, I know that it most likely won’t be possible to build any real connection with either of them. You can’t build a relationship only on the weekends.

      If you don’t have kids, and you’re not willing to meet Monday-Thursday, then you’re not serious enough and I won’t waste my time. A woman like that is probably one of those chicks who are like “I’m not looking for anything too serious, and am just hoping to meet new people, and ‘who knows,'” which translates into some post long-term relationship, pseudo-therapeutic, bang-a-lotta-dudes phase. Fuck that. I’m too old for “sport dating.”

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      • Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

        If you don’t have kids, and you’re not willing to meet Monday-Thursday, then you’re not serious enough and I won’t waste my time.

        I don’t generally meet up Monday thru Thursday until things are more consistent. It’s weekends only for me in the beginning. It’s not because I have any rule about dating during the week, either.I’m just too busy M-Th and exhausted by 7pm.

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        • Horace Says:

          That’s fine for a first date. Weekend dates are sexier anyway. But after that… “When a woman is into a guy, she finds excuses to free her schedule.”

          If you tell me you’re too exhausted during the week, well maybe you’re not that into me.

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          • Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

            Or maybe she’s just not willing to prioritize you yet? Maybe don’t be so needy?

            Guys ask me to get together again.I say Friday, Sat or Sunday. They choose a day. There’s no discussion about why I don’t offer other days. I don’t say how booked/tired/buys I am. I say X, Y Oor Z. They choose. Simple.

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            • Horace Says:

              I wouldn’t color it as needy. But I do want to feel valued, not just another option, and have no interest in wasting my time on nonchalant types who need 3-4 dates to decide if I’m even worth their time. OkCupid is a big catalog. Make an effort.

              Also, I’m the decisive one when I suggest a date (I don’t even ask, per se). I say “Let’s get together. I have Tuesday, Thursday, or Saturday. Let me know and I’ll make a reservation.”

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        • LostSailor Says:

          I don’t generally meet up Monday thru Thursday until things are more consistent. It’s weekends only for me in the beginning

          I generally won’t do a first date on a weekend. Since first meet ups can be a crap-shoot and usually are just a couple of rounds of drinks, it seems a waste of a weekend night. I try to save those for at least a couple of dates in when we’ve both gotten a better sense of each other and can plan and use the evening without the pressure of work the following morning.

          But, as they say, different stroke….

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        • hammersandnails Says:

          My weekends are precious to me, and I’m certainly not burning a weekend night on a date that will likely not result in much. In my experience, even very good online first dates rarely lead to sex. If you want to grab a drink or two and chat, that’s what Tuesday night is for. I certainly want to have something much bigger planned for Saturday.

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      • AnnieNonymous Says:

        I would never date a guy who assumed I had sinister motives or was playing mind games by telling the truth about my long work hours and commute. If that’s the reason, it’s the reason, and you thinking it’s weak doesn’t mean it’s not true. Some people care a lot about their jobs.

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        • DumbFace Says:

          I don’t know that anyone assumes you’re playing mind games or carrying sinister motives but it doesn’t really matter why you can’t spend time with the person, only that you aren’t spending time with them. You have to realize that the person across the table has a job, friends, and hobbies too. They’re with you at that table not because there’s literally nothing else to do but because they’re interested in building a relationship that results in something more than their aforementioned jobs, friends, hobbies, etc. You don’t get there by putting that other person last in your list of priorities… You have to take a risk somewhere, and that usually means culling your agenda a little.

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        • The D-man Says:

          I don’t mind someone telling me she’s busy. What I do mind is her not counter-offering a day when I suggest one that doesn’t work for her. If that happens, I just say “get back to me when you know your schedule” and assume she’s not really interested in meeting again.

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  6. LaMotta Says:

    I agree the “I have to wait” thing seemed a bit needy. Other than that, looks like you had a foot in the door, don’t screw it up.

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  7. Marie Says:

    Or she could just be busy. Was the date just this past Wednesday? If it was, then this weekend was St. Paddys day weekend. She’s in her mid-20s. It is entirely possible that she didn’t want to meet up because she already had a weekend of partying planned. Considering that your first date was a Wednesday night and you stayed out for four rounds of drinks, it’s not unlikely that she likes to party. All over the city there were events like ‘keggs and eggs’ or pub crawls that started at 8am. In all honesty, if you start drinking at 8am, chances are you’ll be drunk by noon. Maybe she is really into him and just didn’t want to meet the second time in a heavy party atmosphere.

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    • Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

      The letter was submitted March 7th. So St. Patrick’s day wasn’t an issue.

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  8. LostSailor Says:

    Scott: If she’s at all interested, a week and a half is too long between dates. And if she has any kind of social life, her weekend following your date was probably booked, so a reasonable time-frame would be drinks and/or a light dinner the following week, which she apparently agreed to.

    However, your biggest mistake was putting her on the spot at the end of the first date. Definite mood killer, man. It’s fine to suggest getting together again, in fact it’s pretty much standard. But if it was a good date, you want her to take that feeling home with her along with the idea of getting together again. She’ll also need to process the whole thing, perhaps even talk it all over with her girlfriends, especially if she is into you. The best way to leverage her feelings is to call or email (some people frown on doing this by text, but your mileage may vary, so judge the texting for yourself) in the next day or so with a specific suggestion for a date.

    Suggesting or asking for another date is fine, but pressing for a second date while you’re still on the first date is a wrong move…

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  9. CoolDude Says:

    I sometimes wonder if people often over-think things too much on this site. The hardest part of dating in NYC it not meeting people nor the first date, it’s trying to find a way to make someone you like a regular part of your schedule. Chances are, if you’ve been single for some time, you have a schedule you’re used to and implementing a significant other in that can be really tricky. Girls in their mid-20’s, I’ve noticed, are less likely to bend that schedule at first for a guy. Particularly, if they have multiple options, you have to jump around that schedule.

    One unspoken thing that is often never discussed is that some girls end up with guys who, essentially, wore them down. How often have you met a woman and when you ask how she met her husband she tells some sort of story of “well, he was very persistent and so I finally gave him a chance and he grew on me”? Whether or not you this is healthy is up for debate but this seems to be a common trend. Personally, I’m way too arrogant (maybe to a fault) to feel the need to chase someone down but I understand how that works sometimes.

    Also, for those of you who can’t meet up Mon-Thu, I’m not particularly sure what’s wrong with you. We’re all tired from work but if you’re single and trying to meet someone, you just have to put in the effort. Yes, sometimes it feels like homework and there have been PLENTY of times when I’ve been exhausted and too tired to put on the whole charming facade but I’ve done it anyway. A little effort on both sides is always appreciated.

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    • The D-man Says:

      This is true. Some women really do need to feel pursued. My girlfriend got this from her last relationship, which ended in marriage (then divorce). Thankfully she didn’t expect that from me.

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  10. India Says:

    A week and a few days is hardly a long time for a second date. This is not a sign of her interest or lack thereof. You have no claim to her schedule and priority this early in the game – four rounds of drinks does not make you a priority in a woman’s life.
    Making a big deal out of this, however, makes me wonder if a man would turn out to be possessive or controlling (i.e. “you have to make time for me! Me – the dude you met once!!”)

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    • DumbFace Says:

      “you have to make time for me! Me – the dude you met once!!”

      Uhmmm, yeah you kinda do.

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    • LostSailor Says:

      India, the issue isn’t whether she’s making this particular guy a priority. The issue is whether she’s making dating a priority. If she’s so over-scheduled that she can only fit in one date every 10 days, then she’s not making dating a priority. A week and a half is a pretty long time between early dates. As Moxie says, it kills any momentum with attraction. The second date is almost starting a square one again.

      It’s not about this one guy at all, but not surprised you used it as an opportunity to personalize the issue to take pot-shots at men…

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      • fuzzilla Says:

        How is she taking pot-shots at men? You could easily reverse the genders and her comments would still hold (i.e., a woman has a pretty good date, guy seems less invested in setting up a second date but then agrees to squeeze her in. I’m sure a woman would be called clingy and get a round of “um, sweetheart, you barely know the guy”s if she said “I have to wait 10 days to see you?” on date #1 – as she should).

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      • D'Alias Says:

        I agree this isn’t a pot shot. Professionals who work with domestic violence perps and survivors warn about this kind of aggression as a Red Flag that the man might be abusive or controlling. Not every red flag leads to fire, but why even raise the issue if that’s not who you really are?

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        • DumbFace Says:

          Other Red Flags include moustaches, penises, and opinions. They disagree on timing, he makes a comment, and now he’s abusive? Puleeeez come back to reality.

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          • fuzzilla Says:

            Red flag means “possible danger” not “definite danger.” She never said he was abusive.

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            • DumbFace Says:

              No fuzz, she (?) implied it. It’s nonsensical finger-pointing and it’s disgustingly accusatory. If we’re going to get anywhere with equality, end “rape culture” and progress as a society, we need to stop villainizing one another.

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              • fuzzilla Says:

                It is completely “sensical” to pay attention to behavior patterns and gut feelings. What else do you have to go on to assess a near stranger? She’s not advocating shouting “rape” at someone she barely knows, just paying attention to their behavior and making note of it. Saying “I have to wait 10 days to see you?” on a first date set off my creep-o-meter and I wasn’t the only one who felt that way.

                You’re the one who villainizes people as far as I can see (“morons,” “losers by default,” “oh right, penises and opinions are Red Flags”). Calm the fuck down, dude.

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                • DumbFace Says:

                  Fuzz… you were beating on a guy for having the guts to ask women how he might improve his profile. That’s pretty poor man.

                  Today’s OP probably shouldn’t have said anything about timing. He should have smiled, let it play out, and either went with her schedule or moved on. He knows that. That’s where that conversation ends. The assertions of abusive/controlling behavior are completely nonsensical given the evidence.

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                  • fuzzilla Says:

                    >Today’s OP probably shouldn’t have said anything about timing. <

                    Yes, and why is that? Because it sends, at best, the message that he's clingy. At worst, it sends the message that he might be controlling and possessive. If he doesn't want to send that message, then good for him for seeking advice and (we hope) being willing to examine his beliefs and behavior and restrategize. That is the alpha and the omega of D'Alias' point.

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                    • DumbFace Says:

                      No, at the best it sends the message that he’s excited to see her, and wants to spend time with her. At the (rational) worst, it’s unattractive.

                      Let’s refrain from calling people abusive until they’re actually abusive. Painting every guy a woman isn’t “in to” as a “creep” or a “miscreant” is just as bad as calling women who are sexually active “sluts”.

                      You might examine a few of your own beliefs.

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              • India Says:

                A week and a half is not a long time if you have a good social and family life.
                Microanalysis of number of days is not attractive. If you are sitting around counting the number of days and hours until the second date, you may just need to work on having more of a life.
                If you can’t deal with 9 days, move on and date women who are more Available to you. Don’t expect others to change for you.

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          • D'Alias Says:

            Did I hit a nerve? Basic reading comp skills show I did NOT call OP abusive. Note the OR in abusive OR controlling. And I said his behavior was a Red Flag – not an undeniable edict. Red Flag = warning sign that these traits MIGHT exist here. I assume OP is normal and prob didn’t realize his statement could be taken that way. If he was an abuser he prob wouldn’t be seeking advice on a dating blog cuz he wouldn’t think he had a problem.

            Wait until you’re getting Abused to call someone an Abuser? That’s so silly, I can’t believe you really think that’s how it should go.

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            • DumbFace Says:

              D’Alias,

              I don’t know how familiar you are with the current discussion surrounding “Slut-shaming” and “Rape Culture” (it’s not even really new) but without getting into too much detail, the premise is such that women should be able to feel completely comfortable with their sexuality and engage in responsible sexual behavior at their discretion. “Slut-shaming” is the process by which society (both men and women) imposes constraints on female sexuality by verbally harassing women who choose to be sexually active and/or dress in certain ways.

              As the discussion has evolved, young men have expressed another type of verbal harassment that they’ve been subjected to, which is the idea that if they’re not found to be attractive by a potential mate, they’re treated as virtual criminals or outcasts (again by men and women) when their behavior demonstrated nothing that should be considered dangerous.

              What both of these social responses amount to is high intensity bullying aimed at keeping sexuality repressed. The resultant effect has led to suicides, shootings, and acts of sexual violence against women and men.

              Now that that’s out of the way, I’ll say that the main audience for this discussion is primarily young adults (15 – 28). That said, our youth learn a lot of their behaviors from their peers, media messages, etc. so if any amount of real change is going to be made (and you’re not completely opposed altogether, which you may very well be), everyone should at least be aware. I understand that you think you’re being helpful by pointing out “Red Flags” but in this particular case, the guy asked a simple question. It’s not only non-productive to assert that he’s potentially “controlling” or “abusive” when he’s not acted in any dangerous manner, it’s qualifiably detrimental. If you need a counter-example, think of a woman wearing a low-cut dress.

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              • fuzzilla Says:

                >If you need a counter-example, think of a woman wearing a low-cut dress.<

                These two things have nothing to do with each other. A woman wearing a low cut dress is simply existing. A man behaving in a pushy manner toward a woman (pouting when he doesn't get his way, which everyone here universally agreed was a bad move on his part) MAY be a clue that he's abusive or MAY simply be social awkwardness. FOR THE LAST TIME, NO ONE SAID HE WAS ABUSIVE. The consensus seemed to be that his behavior was off-putting. Some said the behavior was off-putting because it shared similarities with people who later prove themselves to be abusive. D'Alias is absolutely right that a smart woman would be gone way before a guy offers 100% "proof" he's an abuser.

                Anyway, you're clearly just hearing that one word, abuse, and flipping out and not listening to anything else that's said. Agreed to disagree. Good day. (I was gonna reply to your other message, but there was no Reply button, so I figured Moxie was getting tired of all this and shut it off).

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                • DumbFace Says:

                  A counter-example of the first kind of bullying/shaming, Fuzz.. Jesus. The rest of your post doesn’t even begin to attempt any level of critical thinking.

                  And agreed, for what it’s worth. Please ignore my comments from now on. And if it doesn’t kill you, avoid wasting everyone’s time with another reply to this one.

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                  • Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

                    I don’t know who you are or where you came from, but you’ve managed to become one of my least favorite commenters in a very short period of time. You’re no less an attention whore than anybody else. I’m done listening to the whiny Manosphere bullshit. The only reason why you guys even posts on blogs like this is to interact with women. The idea that this has become a conversation about rape culture is fucking ridiculous.

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                    • DumbFace Says:

                      You’re more than likely just fatigued with the discussion in general — it’s been droning on for ages. I talked about it because I work with high school kids, and it’s a large part of our sexual health curriculum. There are kids on both sides of the fence who’ve been subjected to many nasty behaviors and none of it is pretty. There’s a very real problem with making assumptions about otherwise innocuous behaviors (like choice of clothing, or expressing interest in a mate). It may sound “whiny” to you (as do most people you choose to dislike), but there’s nothing whiny at all about defending a principled attempt at fostering communication and respect across the sexes.

                      In any case, I’m sorry you don’t like me but I found it amusing that you were able to say “I don’t know who you are” and “guys like you” in the same paragraph. I think you’re right though, I have no reason to be here. See ya!

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    • HammersAndNails Says:

      If you are really that busy or work that hard, I’m better off looking for a woman with enough time on her hands to actually be present for a relationship.

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      • Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

        Oh. So you get to apply arbitrary rules as to when you go out on dates, but other people can’t? You can say that weekends are too valuable for a first date. But a woman can’t apply a similar rule to week nights? Good to know.

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        • AnnieNonymous Says:

          I wanted to say something similar to all of the “what’s wrong with you9-to-5 people?” comments. I almost want to lob a counter-question back at them: are their weekends really that important? Is it really so hard to go on your date and meet up with your friends later if the date sucks? As one of the few single women in my group of friends, I like to think that my weekends will always be fun, but they’re rarely consistently exciting anymore. Most of my friends are with their boyfriends on those days. I don’t always feel like going out alone. A Friday night when my friends aren’t around is the perfect time to go on a date with a new guy.

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          • HammersAndNails Says:

            I don’t mean to be unkind here, but you’ve kind of answered your own question and shown exactly what I’m afraid of. If you spent more time and energy working on your social life and expanding your circle of friends, you would be back to Saturday night being as consistently exciting as they used to be instead of having to go out alone.

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            • AnnieNonymous Says:

              I’m hovering around the age of 30. I don’t want my weekends to be full of crazy partying anymore. I don’t need more friends. Just because they’re not free on weekends doesn’t mean they’re not still valuable to me. Why would I pad my social life with people who, by virtue of the activities at hand, are bound to be significantly younger than I am? Guys in their 30s who pick up party friends in their early 20s are so pathetic to me.

              You’re going to try to argue this point, but professional women my age (and older) don’t tend to want to date men who reserve their weekends for partying without them.

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        • HammersAndNails Says:

          Don’t know what to tell you. you date people that like weekend dates and I’ll date people who like weekday dates. I fail to see where I told anyone when they have to go on dates, or what “rules” they can have. If I can’t work out a time to go on a date that works for me, I’m sure she can find someone else to take her out just fine.

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          • Marie Says:

            I’m not sure what kind of time you have on your hands that you can exclusively date on weekdays… 9 to 5 does not exist for anybody I know in New York. It’s more like 8 to 7, or later. Tack the gym onto that and I don’t know many people who are getting home before 9pm on weekdays.

            Despite that, I actually never minded weekday dates because it was less awkward to end them short. But to not date on weekends is severly limiting to your options.

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            • HammersAndNails Says:

              Marie,

              I simply haven’t found it to be a problem. I’m thinking back, and I don’t believe I’ve ever had a woman refuse to schedule a weekday date. I’ve certainly turned down some weekend dates and countered with weekday ones. Maybe it’s happened once or twice, but it’s certainly not a common problem for me. I’m 33 and tend to date 24-28, and lifestyle compatibility and flexibility is a large part of why.

              I’m loathe to make this more contentious as it appears people are taking it personally, but It actually is somewhat of an indicator of compatibility for me. I’m actually very turned off by a woman who is so unavailable, rigid, or tired that she simply can’t pull it together to have a glass of wine or two on a tuesday.I’m not trying to make some judgement. Maybe she’s saving lives 18 hours a day, I’m still just not interested. I will admire her dedication from afar, and date an available woman. I’m often not in the house for the night until midnight on worknights and I struggle to get to bed before 1:30. An early bird dating a night owl really is kind of annoying for both parties. I also fear that if a woman needs a okcupid date with a stranger to save her from being alone on saturday night, she’s going to be clingy because she does not have her own life. I want a girl who has her own hobbies and cool sometimes inclusive, sometimes not, social life so she adds to my life instead of resents it.

              I specifically said first dates. If a woman and I are at the stage of the game where having a good dinner, and then a concert/dancing/something, followed by nice saturday all the time in the world break out the lingerie sex is reasonable, sure, that’s a Saturday night. A saturday date where the woman bails on me when I ask her back to my place is going to be a lot more awkward and offputting than it is on a tuesday. I’d rather save us both from that.

              I’m usually home by 6:30, but that is absolutely by design after dealing with exactly what you are talking about, so I completely understand what you are saying. Even when I would get home at 7:30, I can still get something to eat and decompress for half an hour and make a 9pm date. Usually if the date goes well we’ll hang out from 8:30 – 11:15. If the woman is an early riser, calling it a night at 10:15 is not really a problem. It’s also not my personal preference, but a lot of women seem to like grabbing a drink right after work. I am in the gym 3 days a week, and that’s important to me, but I can schedule that around my dating and social life.

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              • India Says:

                “she’s going to be clingy because she does not have her own life”

                I see. A girl needs to be available enough on weekays, but not too available as to be “clingy” if she wants to spend Sat night with you. Well, talk about rigidity – A girl needs to score the perfect availability factor to be good enough for dating. This is not exactly flexible or tolerant in my book.

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              • Marie Says:

                Well, that’s amusing. You like a certain type of woman because they are flexible and not rigid – yet you are the one setting rules. Nowhere did I mention anything about a woman being unavailable during the week, just that you could be limiting your dating by refusing to consider a weekend. Hmm, that doesn’t sound terribly laid back. On top of that you broke down date times into 15 minute incriments to prove they can get home early. How is that not rigid?

                I do have to ask, what would make you assume a woman has no plans if she meets you for lunch or happy hour on a Saturday? Likely she does and will leave you to attend to her prior plans.

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                • HammersAndNails Says:

                  Lol. I’m sorry I just can’t muster the energy to get defensive about this. I was just trying to sketch out a picture. I’m the guy. I’m the one that’s socially responsible for asking girls out. I ask girls out when I want to go out. Would it make you ladies happier if I promised that the next girl that approached me, gets my phone number, and makes the first move to contact me with a date plan to propose to me, that I will accept any time she proposes? Fine. I promise. Next time that happens I will go on a date with her whenever she wants. This has never been a point of contention with anyone I’ve actually dated.

                  Lunch on is certainly too “let’s just be friends” for me, so that wouldn’t really be my style. A date that I know is going to end with her blowing me off is a date I probably wouldn’t bother going on. Asking for her undivided attention on Saturday is a big ask though. That’s why, before the saturday date crowd got so militant, I assumed most people went on early dates during the week.

                  I have preferences and enough options to afford them. Yes, I want a girl who probably has weekend plans, but is not too busy to spend a weeknight with me without having to wait a week and a half. I am unapologetic about that.

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  11. DumbFace Says:

    I probably wouldn’t have said anything about waiting but I probably wouldn’t have done much else either. You can take as long as you like to get back to me for “date #2″ but don’t expect me to be waiting there when you get around to it. I’ll most likely not even return your call.

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  12. Mia Says:

    Mia, your question/comment was removed.

    If you’d like to submit your comment as a question please use the appropriate form. Thanks. – Moxie

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  13. meh Says:

    this website that usually tells people not to put up barriers to finding a relationship & tells people how to spot red flags seems to not be doing either in this post. the men are pointing out a red flag about women.

    refusing to meet on a weeknight is a red flag. a relationship does not take place only on the weekends. if you can’t meet on a weeknight it does not bode well for the future. she is not going to prioritize her relationship and any man would do well to avoid a woman like that. and i say women because it is usually women who have this red-flag.

    to quote some of the other men on here:

    “The issue is whether she’s making dating a priority. If she’s so over-scheduled that she can only fit in one date every 10 days, then she’s not making dating a priority. “

    and my favorite

    “it doesn’t really matter why you can’t spend time with the person, only that you aren’t spending time with them. You have to realize that the person across the table has a job, friends, and hobbies too. They’re with you at that table not because there’s literally nothing else to do but because they’re interested in building a relationship that results in something more than their aforementioned jobs, friends, hobbies, etc. You don’t get there by putting that other person last in your list of priorities… You have to take a risk somewhere, and that usually means culling your agenda a little.”

    a reminder ladies: we also have things to do, familes to visit & take care of, groceries to buy, apartments to clean, work to go to, gyms to go to, friends to spend time with, tv to watch, etc.

    but somehow we are able to make time to date on weeknights. because it’s a priority, not an obstacle.

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    • Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

      Or maybe she’s dating multiple people?

      You know, that thing guys do all the time?

      I love it. Men want a woman who is self-sufficient and not a gold digger and in shape and not clingy. Yet when a woman demonstrates and even prioritizes such things she’s “playing games.”

      I love the people who claim that weekends are just too valuable for first dates. Right. Because you’re all being invited to parties and your calendars are all filled to the rafters with invites. Please. You’re sitting at home.

      The people so up in arms about people not making time for them are the people with an abundance of time on their hands. It’s not someone else’s fault that you don’t have more things filling your time.

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      • meh Says:

        no one said anything about playing games. it’s about life priorities. do you want a relationship or not? if you do, you need to put in some effort & prioritize being available. if you prioritize those other things over a date? fine, but don’t complain that you are single because you already made your choice. those other things are more important to you. fine. move along.

        this is a red flag that a woman is of the mindset that a relationship with a man is an afterthought, an accessory to her life, like a purse. i don’t waste time with these types of “sex & the city” girls.

        and you seemed to have missed this part:

        a reminder ladies: we also have things to do, familes to visit & take care of, groceries to buy, apartments to clean, work to go to, gyms to go to, friends to spend time with, tv to watch, etc

        (and because everyone is taking this personally, you don’t know me but yes, actually my life is pretty full with parties & events but i know how to re-arrange my schedule. cancel things with friends, skip those parties, workout in the morning instead of evening, etc.)

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        • Marie Says:

          ”this is a red flag that a woman is of the mindset that a relationship with a man is an afterthought, an accessory to her life, like a purse. i don’t waste time with these types of “sex & the city” girls.”

          I get this point and agree with it. But you’re looking at only one side of the story. Yes, it is a red flag if someone refuses to meet up during the week. On the other side, how is it any less of a red flag when someone refuses to meet up on the weekend? I think that’s the point Moxie is making with her comment.

          During the week, people work. They’re busy – doing things to improve their lives. Should they make time for romance? Sure, if they want a real relationship. But it’s much harder. Especially for women. On a first date, we want to make sure our hair is done, our outfit is perfect, there are no chipped nails, etc. That’s fairly tough to do if I’m running from work to the gym then straight to meet you for a date. If I was really into a guy, I prefered the weekend so that I can take time to get ready and look refreshed/at my best. If I was soso – he’d get the mid-week so I could escape if I want.

          When a man refuses to meet up on a weekend, without a clear reason, to me it implies he’s very worried about partying or “bro time” as many of my friends call it. As fun as they are to hang out with, I wouldn’t really date them, which is why they’re friends. My man parties, I party (far more than the average woman my age), but we’re just 30 and staying out until 4am multiple nights a week is just not the priority. When I hear a guy that’s overly worried about wasting a Saturday night it sets off some red flags that he may not be ready for an actual relationship.

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          • Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

            Thank you, exactly. Before a date, especially before one with a guy I’m dating regularly and sex is a given, there’s a lot to do.

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            • HammersAndNails Says:

              I don’t think anyone here is saying that you shouldn’t go on a date with a person you have been seeing for a bit, especially if you are regularly having sex, on a Saturday.

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          • meh Says:

            Marie i agree with you. it’s a red flag for both genders.

            the men above were mostly talking about 1st dates taking place on a weeknight and you seem to agree that weekend dates are for people who you feel more strongly about.

            If I was really into a guy, I prefered the weekend so that I can take time to get ready and look refreshed/at my best. If I was soso – he’d get the mid-week so I could escape if I want.

            i used to schedule my dates exclusively on Friday nights but after one disaster that lasted 4 hours & ended up with me missing a friend’s birthday party, i can see where they are coming from with regards to scheduling a 1st date on a weeknight.

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  14. Andthatswhyyouresingle Says:

    Scott has just emailed me to clarify few points:

    Comment: Moxie,

    This is Scott, 30 years old, the original poster from your March 17 post, “How Long Should You Wait For The Second Date?”. I thought it necessary to offer some clarification to my original post, your response, and some of the comments that have been posted.

    First off, some background: When I made the comment about “I’m really going to have to wait over a week to see you, huh?” this was said AFTER we had spent some time making out, after we were both tipsy, and it was said in a somewhat jokingly, light-hearted way – it was not made in some menacing way where I threatened the girl and wanted to make her uncomfortable, or guilt her into seeing me again. As some people have commented, correctly so, it was simply a gesture to show the girl that I was into her, and would have rather seen her sooner, as opposed to later.

    The result? We went out the following Tuesday, less than a week later, and had a great second date that lasted over four hours. The third date has already been planned, scheduled for after she gets back from vacation (which she’s currently on) (I’ll admit it – I’m a planner, which might clue you in on why I made the comment initially – because I’d rather have a set second date with a girl I’m interested in as opposed to planning a first date with a new girl).

    I don’t think my behavior was indicative of me being “clingy” or “overly aggressive,” it was just how I chose to handle that situation at that given moment at that given time. As I noted in my original post, this girl indicated that she was seeking older guys in their 30’s because they’re more decisive, mature, etc. etc. Based on my perception of her at that given time, I thought she would respect my decisiveness and intent, instead of being wishy-washy about it. And regardless of how things turn out with this girl, I’m glad I did it, and happy that I’ll be seeing her again.

    Would I say such a thing to each and every girl on a first date whom I’d like to see again? Absolutely not.

    And for those who commented that I may be exhibiting abusive behaviors with such a comment? My advice would be to stop wasting your time attempting to pscyhoanalyze people who post dating questions to a dating blog and get a fucking life.

    Good luck to everyone in their exploits at finding love and dating in whichever city you reside, and thanks for letting me clarify these points.

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  15. mindstar Says:

    Scott those comments were made in part because people had no context in which to evaluate your behavior. You have now provided context for people to do so if they wish.

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  16. ATWYSingle Says:

    test again

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    • Pizzabox Says:

      I’m a single Dad as I have my daughter every other week, I think it’s important that my date understands my schedule. So, I schedule a second date usually a week ahead of time. I keep texts or conversation during the in between time. She can date the competition (I think I’m the best) but I’m confident that if she wants someone else, then it would not work–plus my future partner will accept me and my daughter and the dating desperado type I’ll leave for someone else.

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