Why Don’t Men Like To Date Women With Kids?

Name: M.bedcouplekiss

Question: Ok so here’s my dilemma and I would like an honest answer from men.

I just turned 37 and I am a single mom of a 5 year old boy.  Everyone that first meets me thinks I’m in my late 20s and for that I am thankful.  I take good care of myself and so forth.  However on the dating scene, I am not having much luck.  I was dating a guy for about 10 months but he was also 10 years younger than me which is the first for me.  I was totally weirded out about it but he assured me he didn’t care and that he loves kids and all of that and to be honest we had a very good synergy to the point that the age didn’t really matter.  Well so..that didn’t work out and when the it came down to it, it was my age and the fact that I had a kid.  Ok thanks for that.  Anyway, I have since talked to a few other men (my age group) and I’m getting alot of hesitation because I have a child.  Why is that?  I am a good looking woman, I have a good job, I take care of my home and my kid so why is that an issue?  Is it because a man won’t get all of my attention all the time?  Because if I’m dating someone that I like and want to get to know, I make time, even if it’s in the evening for a few hours to hang out.  This is starting to annoy me and I would just like to know what the REAL issue is here because I feel like I’m starting to lose faith in men and I don’t want that.  I want to find someone I can share my life with.

Thanks.

-M
Age: 37
State:

People are hesitate to date someone with kids because it’s difficult.Scheduling dates is inordinately difficult, there’s a lot of concern about staying over, weekends are almost out of the question depending on their child’s age and their custody agreement. It’s tremendously difficult. Somebody 35-45 years old doesn’t have to tolerate any of that because they have enough options.

Guys your age can still get women who don’t have kids and with whom they can have their own. They don’t have to (nor do they really want to) financially support another person’s child. And no matter what you say, in some way they will be. That’s your answer in a nutshell. You need to be dating men in their early/mid-forties or older. Preferably divorced men with kids of their own who understand your lifestyle and that your child takes top priority.

Yes, younger men will tell you that neither your age nor the fact that you have a child are an issue. They will lie. Or they’ll be too immature to be thinking more than a step or two ahead and won’t consider what dating someone ten years their senior with a child entails. Nobody gets it until they do it. It’s a daunting proposition for many.

The solution for you is pretty simple. You’ll just have to let go of your desire to date men your age. It’s one of the tougher things about dating as a single woman over 35, but it’s crucial.

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125 Responses to “Why Don’t Men Like To Date Women With Kids?”

  1. AnnieNonymous Says:

    She has a kid and has presumably already been married. You can’t make those major life decisions and then reject the notion that those choices have effects. She already had a fresh first round of single-gal dating. Then she got married had a kid. She can’t date the way she used to. In a way she already used up her opportunity to date in the way she seems to want to.

    This woman sounds off though. It’s not just men who don’t want to date people with kids. Women don’t want to date men with kids either. No one’s out to victimize her, and people aren’t hating on her kid for no reason. She sounds like the kind of parent who can’t understand that some people just don’t like kids.

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    • Howard Says:

      Very good AnnieNonymous. Let me further add. To be successful in life, never take things personally. There is an economics to dating. As hard as it is to accept, we all have some perceived worth in our heads about potential dates. And other people have some sense of perceived worth about us. Luckily, everyone measures us differently and that represents the silver lining.

      If our situation is such that many prospects value us less, it is important to not get caught up in bitterness about it. In the end, we do the same when we look at potential dates. And we generally don’t give a hoot what people think. Many women feel entitled to not date that guy who is too short, or that guy without a college education, or that guy who lacks confidence, or that guy with two baby mamas. And guess what? Women are entitled to feel that way. It is also incumbent for women to not get bitter about the guys who want a woman with no kids or any such criteria.

      I am not here to justify any of these criteria. In fact I think most of these, limits the options of the person making the choices, but given, that we all participate, acceptance is necessary.

      I would recommend the OP look at guys in similar positions. The downside, of course, is less money on the table because he is paying child support. There are also other emotional commitments to his kids. The crude reality is that many women with kids avoid men in similar positions, exactly for those reason, less available money and other emotional commitments.

      There used to be a time when people understood the sacrifices that went along with having kids, when the parents were not together. But somehow in our “having it all society”, we seem to gloss over these necessary sacrifices.

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    • Kim Perry Says:

      I knew a young lady that had four boys by a previous marriage and managed to remarry even though she had all those kids.

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    • Ganae Says:

      I’m a female and a man with a child is a deal-breaker for me! I don’t want my own kids, let alone someone else s. The same is probably even more common among men because typically women are more acceptable of children. To me, it would be like being given a piece of gum that was already chewed lol No thanks!

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    • Heather Says:

      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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    • Brooke Says:

      Whether or not she is willing to have another child is important and some men like the younger guy may not be ready yet for a child and with her being 37 he may prefer to let her go than risk her not being able to have a child when he is ready. He still has a lot of other options. She needs to date other men with a child or more of their own and stop worrying about age. It doesn’t matter how young she looks, the truth is she is 37 and may not be able to provide a child or multiple kids to a childless man.

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      • Mandy Says:

        DO YOUR RESEARCH BETTER! I HAVE A SISTER WHO HAD HER CHILDREN IN HER LATE 30’S, WITH OUT ANY PROBLEMS, IN FACT SHE DIDN’T KNOW SHE WAS PREGNANT UNTIL SHE WAS 13 WEEKS ALONG.
        BTW I AM A DIVORCED MOTHER WITH TWO BOYS, AND I AM GETTING MARRIED TO A YOUNGER MAN WITHOUT CHILDREN. HE APPROACHED ME, KNOWING I HAD KIDS AND I AM OLDER.
        WATCH YOUR SILVER TONGUE LITTLE LADY, JUST ONE DAY YOU WILL BE OLDER, AND KARMA IS A SUCKS

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  2. Tanya Says:

    I was a single mom when met husband. I was 29 and he was 27. It worked out. We are now married for over 5 years. If a man loves you he will accept your child as well. Keep looking and do not settle for less.

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  3. Jonathon Factory Says:

    Me: 39, fit, good career, never married, no kids. Children are an instant deal-breaker for all of the reasons Moxie pointed out.

    As for my male friends my age that are divorced with kids, they’ll still date someone the same age, assuming she’s on the high end of attractive.

    Taking her word on it that she’s fit and attractive at 37, she was likely last single when she was childless, fit and attractive in her late 20’s. She could pick and choose amongst numerous high-quality suitors with ease in her last single experience. Those same men no longer viewing her as a long-term option, is probably a shock to the system.

    I suspect “dating down” isn’t palatable for her, so divorced dads are definitely the best option. I break with Moxie on the age aspect and feel men 37 – 40 with kids will still view her as a viable long-term option.

    However, she may need to make peace with the fact those high-quality men in their late 30’s are not going to be jumping through the same hoops to be with her as they were in her younger, childless days. As Moxie said, they just don’t have to anymore.

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    • Jonathon Factory Says:

      As an addendum, I’ll add an observation from a divorced dad that I know. Him: late 30’s, 2 kids, divorced a couple of years from college girlfriend / wife, successful and fit.

      He only dates women with children because they understand his time constraint. HOWEVER, he tries to avoid women with only ONE child and prefers women with two or more. This was really interesting to me, so I pressed him for the details.

      In his experience, women with only one child that didn’t manage to find the blissful relationship to accompany it seem to fixate on the child. Their whole world, quite literally, was the child. Dating that isn’t fun.

      In his own family, he noticed a change not only in his ex-wife but himself with the arrival of their second child. Fixating on the first simply wasn’t an option and he learned to have a “wider view” of the whole thing. For him, having two children was less taxing, mentally, than having one because he no longer fixated on the one 24/7.

      Dating a woman with one child, he said he sees the same fixation that he and his ex-wife likely exhibited in the past.

      I’d never thought about it until he brought it up, but looking at my relatives that have started families, I think I can see what he’s saying.

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      • jay Says:

        whats your obsession with being fit? Is this a subliminal subconscience message of your priorities?

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        • Joey Giraud Says:

          Simple. Fitness is the most important quality in a mate of either sex.

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    • Lele Lulu Says:

      I have finally come to a conclusion after having children in my way younger 20s (I’m divorced and now with long-term partner) and having made time for observation through life experience – all these single, childless, or whatever men who are being selective have an over 50% change of being divorced (at least in California) and will be in the same conundrum as this 37 year old woman once their time comes.

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    • Mandy Says:

      SHE CAN’T DATE WHO EVER SHE WANTS. NOT EVERYONE WANTS AN IMPOTENT MAN IN THEIR FORTIES, NOR DOES SHE HAVE TO DATE A SINGLE DAD. GET OVER THIS ONLY SINGLE PARENTS NEED TO DATE SINGLE PARENTS. THAT IS THE MOST BULL CRAP LIE I HAVE EVER HEARD OF. DATING IS NOT JUST FOR SINGLE CHILDLESS PEOPLE. NOT ALL PEOPLE WANT TO HAVE THE BRADY BUNCH FAMILY!THIS CRAP OF WHAT CAN YOU BRING TO THE TABLE, THAT IS JUST SAYING YOU ARE ONLY LOOKING FOR WHAT’S IN IT FOR YOU, AND CLEARLY YOU’RE NOT LOOKING FOR LOVE. ATTN:CHILDLESS SINGLE PEOPLE, STOP TELLING SINGLE PARENTS WHO AND HOW TO DATE, UNTIL YOU HAVE WALKED A MILE IN THEIR SHOES, YOU HAVE NO IDEA, SO SHUT YOUR MOUTH!

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  4. jane Says:

    Yep. Same reason some women may not want to date a man with children. It’s not ideal to take on all that comes with a partner with a family and ex especially if you have other options. However by your mid thirties there should be plenty of men with children also looking to date. You may find it easier to overcome this issue with someone who is coming to the table from a similar situation and who doesn’t have to make such a big adjustment.

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    • Eliza Says:

      Jane–I fully agree. And this is coming from someone who DID date a man with 2 young children – and who lived upstate–2 hours from NYC. Actually in many cases, men have partial custody – (as was the man I was involved with)–and that entailed visits every other weekend. Still a lot of time and compromising…ALL from my end, not his…since I didn’t have children, and those types of commitments (written in stone–or rather legal documentation)! lol. So–a lot of juggling is going on…one can’t be spontaneous with such circumstances (children)–especially when they are young – not teenagers. When they are older…they actually are looking to become more independent and wanting to spend time with their peers. There were many adjustments…even if you end up living with a man with such circumstances (as I did). Imagine a man making those adjustments – with a mother–who usually get FULL custody. 24/7. It’s a big commitment…and yes, to some extent…financially the partner to that parent’s child will be spending on a child that is not biologically theirs also. The OP needs to reflect a bit, and not take this too personally. The dynamics change significantly due to 1) age, and 2) parenting requirements. And that applies to both genders. Personally, I am in my mid-40’s and would prefer to date a men, who either don’t have children, or if they do–children that are already almost 20 yrs old…which would mean I would have to date men in their late 40’s or early 50’s. Which I am cool with. Unless the guy had a child when he was merely 20 years old. Could happen.

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  5. Bogey44 Says:

    I don’t think having a kid is the real issue here, I think the real issue is that you haven’t accepted that having a kid means you can’t date like you did before you became a mother. I also think there’s some semblance of wanting to retain your youth going on, and you may not be targeting the right guys because of this. In short, it seems as though you haven’t seemed to accept the very valid reasons why some men, especially younger ones, don’t want to get involved with a woman with kids. You’re manufacturing a gender issue here where just as easily the author could be male and the word “men” could be replaced with “women.”

    “I just turned 37 and I am a single mom of a 5 year old boy. Everyone that first meets me thinks I’m in my late 20s and for that I am thankful. I take good care of myself and so forth. However on the dating scene, I am not having much luck.” This seems to be a perception that you really want to believe, but in all likelihood isn’t true. I’m not saying that you’re not attractive (I have no way of knowing) or that women in their mid to late 30’s can’t be attractive, but it’s very rare that they look 10 years or so younger especially if they’ve had children. The fact that you were in a 10 month relationship with a guy 10 years younger than you leads me to believe you want to be able to date guys in the mid to late 20’s. Regardless of the kid issue, most guys that age have enough options in their own age range that they don’t have to date you, so you need to let that go. Secondly, there seems to be some bitterness against 10 years younger guy because he told you your kid and your age weren’t an issue, yet that’s why your relationship ended. Chances are, if he stuck around for 10 months, that wasn’t the real issue it was just the convenient excuse he used. It was a way of trying to let you down gently. Whatever the case, you need to accept the multitude of reasons why kids are a deal breaker for people, and that this is in no way a gender issue. Here are just a few:

    1) Some people just don’t like kids. They don’t want their own, and they don’t want to be around them. Some are okay with other people’s kids (like friends kids, nieces and nephews and such) but don’t want the responsibility of being involved with them on a regular basis. There’s nothing wrong with this, and you just need to eliminate these people from your dating pool.

    2) Scheduling dates with a single mom is tough. I’m 24, and I don’t have kids, but I have a job that doesn’t have a set schedule and that can have me working whacky hours at times. When I meet someone I like I try to get to the first date ASAP because the longer that draws out the more likely things are to fizzle. Same holds true for the time between first and second dates. Personally, I have to try and mesh my schedule with hers, and that’s challenging enough. Now throw a kid into the mix. The woman is not only operating around her own work schedule, but also her child’s schedule, dealing with sitters, and what not. For some guys it comes down to wanting to be the center of attention, sure, but I think for more guys it just draws out the process so much more that it becomes more work the keep up.

    3) The baby daddy/baby momma drama. Like it or not, once you have children you’re bound to the father/mother of the kid for life. They will have some involvement in your life (most times) one way or another. People are conscious of this. Now, this generally falls out of the realm of “acceptable” first date conversation (you’re still strangers and the role of the child’s father isn’t a stranger’s business) which makes it hard to gauge whether or not a guy is “competing” with an ex. In other cases, some people use children as a means to “get back” at an ex. That means by getting involved with someone with children you’re allowing another party to have some influence over your own life and that’s not appealing to everyone. In less sinister cases, the other parent rightly wants to know, and approve of, people who will be spending time around their children for various reasons. An extreme example, last week Viking’s running back Adrian Peterson’s two year old son was killed by a man the child’s mother was dating. A guy who cares about his kids (even if things didn’t work out with the mother) will be wary of people who could be bad influences or potentially harmful to their children. Again, these are all very personal situations that require a certain level of trust to disclosure to someone you’re dating. The other person has to invest a certain amount of time before they’ll find out exactly what kind of situation their walking into, and some won’t be willing to do that, especially if they have other, less dramatic, options.

    4) Having kids says something about you. This is going to sound cold because lord knows there are plenty of single parents running around, but the circumstances of how the kids came to be and the relationship with the other parent can say a lot about the way someone thinks. My automatic assumption (right or wrong) with women around my age that have children is that they did not fully understand/respect the commitment that having a child would entail. That smacks of irresponsibility, and if they’re irresponsible about something that important, how are they going to handle less important situations. You’re older so that doesn’t necessarily apply to you, but there are still other issues that fall under this umbrella. For example, if the father isn’t involved in the child’s life at all, why is that? Why would a woman get involved with someone who has no interest in taking care of his kid? What does that say about her character and judgment?

    5) When you’re in a relationship with someone with kids, you are also “in a relationship” with the child. Your kid is young, so some of these issues won’t apply – at least right now – but they are real. Kids will naturally compare any male figure involved with their mother to their father, and a lot of times will rebel against their “new daddy.” And since the man is not the “father” there’s only so much he can do. I was 15 and my brother was 11 when my parents got divorced, and we gave my mom’s first boyfriend after the divorce hell for no other reason than because he wasn’t our dad. It had nothing to do with him personally, and actually looking back on it he was a really good and really tolerant guy, but we were upset about our parents divorce as well as moody teenagers so he bore the brunt of our frustrations. Around this same time, my aunt, who has two sons, married a guy with three daughters. This guy had grown up with my dad and my aunt, had known the family for close to 40 years at this point. All of the kids involved where between the ages of 12-19. The girls’ mother had passed away a few years prior to the beginning of their relationship. It was a real life “Brady Bunch” scenario. Except the girls gave my aunt hell for the simple fact that she wasn’t their mother. They were still grieving over losing their mother when their dad started dating her and no matter how good to them my aunt was (and believe me she’s a wonderful person) they weren’t going to get along with her because in their minds she was trying to “replace” their mom. Anyway, my point is there’s a lot of juggling, patience, and tolerance required to get involved with the kids, and in some ways it’s more difficult than having kids of your own.

    Not all of this may apply to your situation, but without knowing what your situation is, these are the type of things that will run through a person’s head when they find out you have kids. Making a relationship work is tough enough as it is, and when you throw kids into the mix it just adds a whole bunch of other layers that weren’t there before. This isn’t a male/female divide either like your letter seems to want to make it out to be. In each scenario you can flip flop the genders and it’s just as plausible. And the harsh truth is, no one cares that your kid is making it difficult for you to date. It’s a relatively common situation, it’s a choice you made (albeit most likely not considering how it would impact your dating life when you had the child), and your kid is a blessing so don’t lose sight of that.

    My advice to you is as follows: 1) Stop pitying yourself over how hard it is to date as a single mom. It’s not attractive and you won’t get much sympathy from others. 2) Be realistic about who you want to date. If you want to go after men 10 years younger than you, you’re likely to bang your head against a wall repeatedly and not get anywhere. Instead, focus on guys your own age and older and preferably those with kids themselves or at least guys who want kids. 3) If you haven’t already, try online dating. Be upfront about the fact that you have a kid, state clearly that you’re looking for someone who is good with children and/or has children himself. Then, either in your profile or upon communicating with potential dates (the latter is probably better) do what you can to assure them that some of the common concerns will not be an issue in your case (i.e. baby daddy drama). Good luck.

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    • yb Says:

      got tired of reading this. you should write your own blog.

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    • Frankie Says:

      Did you type all this on your IPhone?? ?

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    • Priya Says:

      This is ridiculous. Someone could have had a wonderful marriage for years and then had kids with the person they thought they woulf be with forever, but that didn’t work out or the person died or whatever, doesn’t mean that they have poor judgment. I was married for 7 years to someone who pretended to be a great guy, but led a double-life. Everyone was shocked when he abandoned me and the baby. I was suddenly single with a child after being with him for 13 years, married for 7. You never know what coulf happen in your life. Any of those men who refuse to date single moms could someday be a single dad.

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      • Just me Says:

        Exactly my situation. Come to find out he is untreated bipolar. When he is stable, life was great. When not, he is a horrible father and person. This is not my fault, not should I be punished.

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    • Eliza Says:

      Very well stated! On all points. By the way – everybody’s situation is different. oddly enough – in my case – the guy’s children (both daughter and son) immediately were affectionate and loving with me…but it was his ex-wife that was still angered–at him, obviously–but it did poison the relationship and our weekends. An ex-spouse can create havoc…if in fact that’s their intention. Vacations had to be scheduled “around the kids”, weekends had to be scheduled “around the kids”, dinners out, you name it, and it makes sense if a guy does make his children his No. 1 priority…as it should be. The bottom line is, dating someone with young kids – is NOT for everyone. Takes a lot of work to make it work.

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  6. D. Says:

    35 year old man here. My reasons for not wanting to date a woman with kids:

    1. I want to have a family of my own, and the notion of trying to mesh that with an existing kid is…daunting. It might work (my cousin’s doing it and is fine with it), but it’s just not something I want to do. I’d rather “start fresh” with someone.

    2. It can be a logistical hassle. Spontaneity goes out the window when you have to juggle a sitter coming over or whathaveyou. Doubly so if the father really isn’t involved in the kid’s life, so the kid is pretty much always there. I’m single and don’t have any particular responsibilities that REQUIRE me to be home at a particular time (well, other than maybe wanting to get a good night’s sleep for work the next day), and it’s nice to sometimes do something spontaneous when you’re further along in the relationship. With a woman with kids, that’s not possible.

    3. For parents who are less selective about who meets their kids, I never wanted to be “Mommy’s special friend” who shows up for a couple of weeks and then disappears when things don’t work out. I have friends who grew up like that, and they HATED it. I refuse to do be party to that kind of thing. On the flipside, for parents who are much more careful about who meets their kids, I really REALLY do not like the idea of becoming involved in a kid’s life after gaining the mother’s trust, and then things falling apart. I know people who’ve been seriously involved with someone who had a kid, and go to a point where they were close to the kid as well. When things ended, they had to completely cut off their relationships with the kids in addition to the parents. I never EVER wanted to do that.

    4. There’s an element of divided attention. I don’t need to be THE MOST important thing in a woman’s life, but I’m going to make her a priority in a particular way, and the simple fact is that a woman with kids cannot reciprocate at the same level.

    5. There are plenty of single women without kids, and dating can be difficult enough under the best of circumstances, so why bother with adding a known set of hurdles into the mix?

    To be clear, I HAVE dated women with kids. Most of the time, it wasn’t an issue, but that was within the context of casual dating. This was particularly true with women I dated who were older than I was. I didn’t care that they had kids because (A) I was never gonna meet them, and (B) it was never gonna get serious anyway because they had kids, the age difference was a barrier, and (C) it was all strictly casual anyway. I tried dating a woman my own age who had a kid and was going through a divorce. It was fun while it lasted, but it was likely always doomed to failure anyway. I’d have been willing to give it a shot (or so I thought at the time), but realistically it probably wouldn’t have worked in any case.

    What most people have said here already is accurate: change your target audience. Guys with kids of their own, ideally. Older guys, too. But the simple fact is that life is different now from how it was when you were last dating, which I’m guessing was at least 7 years ago, if not more. Online dating has DRAMATICALLY altered the landscape for everyone, because there is the perception of near limitless options — which means you can always just keep looking for your own ideal scenario (whatever that is). Likewise, you’re 37, and that in and of itself starts to create issues even if you didn’t have a kid. Throw in the kid, and it’s a whole other ballgame. So, don’t set yourself up for a fall — target the people who’ll be wanting to date you, rather than holding out for guys who, at least statistically speaking, are less likely to see you as a viable long-term partner. That’s not to say you can’t find any guy your age (or even younger) who’ll accept the situation, of course. They’re out there. But you may find yourself waiting a LONG time for him to show up, and he may never come.

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    • Brooke Says:

      I’m sick of men with your mentality wanting a fresh start and going younger. I am a childless woman with a great career and I don’t want all the baggage of a divorced dad and I’m tired of them pursuing me. I have had several lie about wanting another child when they didn’t just to keep me. It didn’t work and I’m tired of my time being wasted. I’m NOT going to do all the work and make all the sacrifices in a relationship. I have other options and I’d rather be alone that settle. At least I don’t have to deal with his bratty kids and my house is quiet and clean!

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      • Mandy Says:

        EVERY ONE HAS A GREAT CAREER AND LOOKS HOT ON THE INTERNET.. COMPLETE LIES!

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    • Sharee Says:

      I agree with you D. Some of your points are the same reason I do not want to date a man with children. I’m currently experiencing that and it is he worst. I had to cut him loose; especially after in so many words he mentioned that she would always be put first. I will play second to no one!
      When I state to people that I will no longer date a man with children, 99% of them tell me that I am crazy and wish me luck. I believe that I will get exactly what I want. I don’t have children so why commit myself to the burden of someone else’s parenting. I’ll pass!

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  7. BostonRobin Says:

    Sometimes I wonder if the child simply becomes an excuse for either party. Like age or location or income, or anything else that is known to exist from the beginning but “suddenly” becomes an issue 10 months later.

    Don’t become fixated on the notion that you’re having trouble dating because of the child, since it could be something else. People rarely tell the truth when they reject someone–even to themselves. Honestly I think it’s more likely that the LW is making common mistakes like shooting out of her league. I mean, there are plenty of women over 35 who write Moxie the childless version of this same letter: younger man, fabulous chemistry, doesn’t last.

    Also, in my experience dating or trying to date people with children, I have sometimes gotten the feeling that they sort of hide behind the child too. The parent is going to have to work on bringing this new person in to become part of their parent-child relationship. That’s not easy, because you have to figure out if this person you want sex with is also going to be good with your child.

    If your priority is finding someone to date and have sex with, you may be missing out on the ones who would actually love to have a relationship that included a child. My guess is that a single mother of 37 who would get involved with a man ten years younger is looking for a good time, not a new father for her child. You had a hot ten months. Now take Moxie’s advice and go for the older men. Five year olds are at the prime cuteness age, so there is no time to waste.

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  8. WO7 Says:

    Scenarios from best to worst (as far as marriage and kids go):
    Younger woman, never married, no kids.
    Younger woman, divorced, no kids.
    Older woman, never married, no kids.
    Younger woman, never married, kids.
    Younger woman, divorced, kids.
    Older woman, never married, kids.
    Older woman, divorced, no kids.

    For the last guy you dated…you were the worst case marriage/kids scenario.

    For someone to accept this less desirable scenario, something else has to offset it. Perhaps amazing career, out of their league looks wise, head over heels in love, or something else that matters to them.

    Men will most definitely tell women who are older or have kids what they want to hear in order to continue to date/get laid. There is a perception that women with kids (especially single moms) are easier to get with. From my experience, they’re usually harder to get with.

    Why do men prefer women who are younger, not divorced, and no kids?

    Younger women tend to be more attractive, and stay attractive longer.
    Younger women tend to have more years to give birth to children.
    Divorced women means you likely have to deal with ex husband issues.
    Kids means the father will always be in your life, and means you have to pay money to raise someone else’s kid.

    So yeah, adjust your expectations. If you want the best chance, go for someone older who also has kids. If you want to keep shooting for the moon…go for it. But remember that your chances of success are much lower.

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    • meh Says:

      this is an awesome breakdown.

      women should learn what their league is instead of thinking that they are still entitled to the best men even after they have strikes against them.

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    • wishing u well Says:

      Random (and a little off topic).

      You know what surprised me about your assessment?

      “Older woman, divorced, no kids” was outranked by “Older woman, never married, kids”

      Out of curiousity – why is that?

      Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 34 Thumb down 2

      • WO7 Says:

        Because when a kid is involved, whomever fathered/mothered that kid will likely always be in the picture. People who are divorced don’t have to have as much interaction with each other, and can have none at all if they want to/everything works out.

        Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 22 Thumb down 13

      • Kristin Says:

        Elaborate on: Older woman, 37 who has kids…(20 in college and on his own, 18 who graduates next spring and is off to a tech school out of state), own career, involved in her community. Two degrees, takes good care of herself.

        Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 3 Thumb down 29

        • Eliza Says:

          You had a child at 17? I guess men would wonder how they would have to contribute financially. If not, and all else is true…your target audience could be men in their early 40’s. Still, men who are in their 30’s or younger WILL prefer women younger than them. Doesn’t matter how old or young YOU feel, or state or consider yourself to look. That’s YOUR perspective. Your own opinion of yourself. The bottom line is your real age. 37 years old. Also consider this: Men in their mid to late 30’s or EVEN early 40’s may want their own biological children. Is that something you are willing, ready and able to do again? There is always the flipside…when you are talking “long-term”…casual dating is one thing…fun times are all you can think about. Long-term is a whole different ball game.

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        • Lele Lulu Says:

          Similar to 37 year old here who has a child in college. I was 17 when I had my boy, and 21 when I had my girl. Yes, both from same father and yes we are divorced. I am now 36 years old and typically don’t even consider a single man in his 30s – too young for me and lacks life experience.

          Also, I have two degrees as well and working on my MBA now. The best part is I am now with a 47 year old man who I love dearly and all the past men who wouldn’t date me did me a favor in order to be where I am now.

          However, I am also aware that he probably would not be with me if I lacked a successful well-paying career and in graduate school which I pay out of pocket. And I also paid child support for my children, not the other way around.

          Putting my business hat on, I think in the end, us single parents need to make ourselves an asset because in the end humans want whats in it for them. So it is a safe bet that if you have something to offer that exceeds the negatives of having a child, a man will probably consider the single mom (or vice versa).

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  9. Will Says:

    I think this is a simplification. If it’s the right person, men will commit, but not because we have laid to rest our concerns about scheduling conflicts. It’s more about trying to be an honest, good person in the eyes of a family. Older men can be just as immature. Come on. Dating a family takes nuance and commitment and sometimes the generous thing to do is to just not do it rather than be a draining interloper.

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  10. LostSailor Says:

    Yes. To Moxie’s advice and the reasoning in the commentary.

    Just a couple of notes:

    Is it because a man won’t get all of my attention all the time? Because if I’m dating someone that I like and want to get to know, I make time, even if it’s in the evening for a few hours to hang out.

    As has been mentioned, a man you’re dating doesn’t expect all of your attention all of the time, but he does probably expect more of your time than just hanging out in the evening, especially if it’s with your child.

    This is starting to annoy me and…I feel like I’m starting to lose faith in men and I don’t want that. I want to find someone I can share my life with.

    So, now it’s the guys’ fault that they might not want to date a late-thirties single mom. How shallow and faithless of them. But, of course, M is not just looking for someone to “share her life with” it’s looking for someone to share her and her kid’s life. He’s not just dating you, he’s also “dating” your child. And what if he wants to find someone to share his life? M seems to think it all flows only one way.

    I have dated, casually, a few single moms. The ones with older children were much easier to date, as the kids could look after themselves in the evening. The few single moms I’ve dated with young children simply didn’t work out. Now I will not date a woman with a child, especially if that child has not reached his/her teens. And the reason I won’t is because, as others have noted, it’s not fair to the child. I absolutely do not want to become part of a young child’s life, especially if the father is generally absent, and then have the relationship fall apart.

    That M hasn’t though that part through seems a bit selfish.

    Moxie is right: older men with children are her target market. M may not think it fair, but, then, life isn’t fair…

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  11. katie Says:

    Really? All that negativity about dating men your age that do not have kids, not wanting her?…I find it untrue in my case, anyways. Sure, of course there are men that fall into the categories of not wanting a woman with a ‘ready made’ family, however, this woman is 37! I too look young for my age and have been a single mom, since age 21..Now, while men in their 20’s(and I still dated a lot in my 20’s) tend to be much more unforgiving in that aspect, men your age(at 37) should be more forgiving….I always had a long term relationship in my 20’s as well, and was engaged twice(once at 28 and another time at 33, to men very close to my age!). I called it off in both circumstances because they were not right, but my point is her child should not be ‘that’ big of a deal breaker, at 37. The men I was engaged to, as well as most men I have dated did not have any children and had never been married either….so, do not listen to all the negativity. You do not have to date a divorced man, with kids, who is many many years older than you..Especially, if you are attractive and look years younger than your age. Sure, the dating pool is smaller but so what? Never settle and enjoy your child, get involved with activities with him as much as you can..and get out and meet as many people as you can. (:

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 22 Thumb down 78

    • LostSailor Says:

      men your age(at 37) should be more forgiving…her child should not be ‘that’ big of a deal breaker, at 37

      Why should they be more forgiving? Why shouldn’t her or your child be a deal breaker for single, childless men? Because you want it to be so? Sorry, hon, but we don’t live in a “should” world. Just because you want it, doesn’t mean you can dictate your desires to men and expect them to fall in line. You can get all resentful when they don’t, but it won’t help.

      do not listen to all the negativity.

      It’s not negativity, it’s reality.

      you do not have to date a divorced man, with kids, who is many many years older than you.

      Now who’s being unforgiving and setting deal-breaking rules? At 36, women should be more forgiving and accepting of men with children older than they. They deserve love, too!

      I am 36(almost37)but get asked, quite frequently, if I am 24 or 25,

      Katie, they’re lying to you to flatter you. It seems to work…

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      • katie Says:

        LostSailor, you seem to have an unhealthy and negative viewpoint of women…And seem to take enjoyment in putting this women and other women, ‘in their place’ as far as what they can get. Why is that? What is wrong with being realistic that other outcomes can and do happen everyday…I am not sure your reason for venom spitting, but I have had quite a few very long-term relationships with childless and never before married men(and as I mentioned engagements). It is not a big deal and happens everyday.

        Also, when I said I was told I looked 24 to 25..I forget to mention that most times these comments are from other women. Women that work at checkout, friends of friends, colleagues, at gym…These women are not lesbians that I know of..hehe. Not that it is a big deal. I try not to pay much attention to it, but had to make the point since the other poster made a comment that a woman looking 10 years younger is pretty much impossible.

        Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 15 Thumb down 77

        • D. Says:

          You write about what “ought” to be. Many people — myself included — end up screwing themselves over by clinging to some notion of how life and dating “ought” to go. We latch on to some fantasy notion of how romance is supposed to be, how dating works, what’s realistic to expect in dating and who will date us, etc. Most of the time, clinging to these fantasies is what keeps us alone and unhappy, or falling for “too good to be true” scams that we really should’ve caught sooner. We strive to attain this ideal scenario or set of circumstances, only to wind up frustrated that it isn’t working out, which often leads us to making the same damn mistakes (or new ones).

          So, yeah, you can beat the odds, and people do. But if someone is going to try to do so, they need to make that choice soberly and realistically. They should recognize and accept that the path they’ve chosen will, in all likelihood, be a difficult one and possibly even a fruitless one. If someone says to themselves “some day my prince/princess will come,” hey, fine and dandy. Hold out for that happiness if you want. But do so with the understanding that it’s a choice you’re making.

          The other suggestions about “Try dating older guys” isn’t about “SACRIFICE YOUR DREAMS AT THE ALTAR OF GRIM REALITY!!!!” It’s about “Hey, you know, you might actually be happier if you stepped away from chasing a fantasy and looked at what’s around you here in the real world. There’s lots to enjoy here.” I don’t personally think that the good contributors here say this stuff out of bitterness or animosity. They say it — bluntly sometimes — in the hopes that it may shake someone awake from a deluded daydream into attaining REAL happiness that’s right in front of them, but that they’re passing over while chasing the fantasy instead.

          As for the notions that this or that person looks XYZ years younger, this has been addressed repeatedly here. First, it’s a mistake to rely on the comments of people who are NOT your target audience. If you were conducting a focus group on an advertisement, would you ask women to rate how effective a truck commercial will be at selling that truck to men? Would you ask men how effective a commercial is at selling pantyhose to women? Of course not. You’d ask the target market. If you want to attract a man, women are not a useful focus group. Second, you don’t look ten years younger. Nobody does. People may look great for their age, but the whole “ten years younger” thing is how we bullshit ourselves into avoiding the uncomfortable truth that we’re all gettin’ older. Focus less on “ten years younger” and more on “you look great!” And besides, merely because you LOOK ten years younger does not mean you ARE ten years younger. And if a guy is hung up on age, your looks alone are probably not the only factor in his calculus.

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          • katie Says:

            I think you are reading way too much into it. You can say that it is delusional all you want, but my point is….that it IS reality when women with kids get married and have relationships with men their age(even with men who are childless and have never been married). I’ve never heard such misogynistic tripe as being referred to as, ‘hon’, and other such derogatory responses to my post, which are just giving my own personal experiences to the OP, on the matter. Of course, every situation is different and depends on the person and even city one lives, but who are people to say on here that her only hope is to go with someone much older, who has been divorced with kids..utter rubbish. And those can stomp their feet all they want on here and say I’m not being realistic, but I cannot argue with my experience and the experience of people I know personally(that prove otherwise). Not what is ‘said’ on the internet..OP do not believe everything that is ever said on internet blogs by bitter men..ever see the State Farm commercial? Everything said on the internet isn’t true, you know..hehe

            Also, so what if I do..or do not look 10 years younger? You have not seen me, so cannot say something ridiculous as, ‘people who are not my target market are saying this’. What a nonsensical statement. If you do not even know what I look like,then how can one know what the people commenting on my age look like (or, what target market they are in..lol)?? If I say men said it, then you say they are ‘flattering me’, then if I say women(and men in all areas of my life)say it too, then they are not my ‘target market’…so, pray tell who should say it to be true? Actually, do not tell me because I do not care, as no one on here even knows what I look like, which is definitely NOT my target market. I am not making a deal of it, as you say, but only commented because someone else posted that looking 10 years younger is not possible…yet, it is possible. You guys are the ones that keep bringing it up that ‘it cannot be true’. To say it is not or that this OP can never find a man her age with no children, is a delusional viewpoint. It may be more the exception than the rule, but is possible. Why deny that possibility to her? And ‘so what’ if she decided to be picky and wait 10 more years to settle down, even? There are plenty of people(women)I know who do that as well..sheesh, this site is funny with all the women hate, hehe.

            Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 21 Thumb down 71

        • LostSailor Says:

          Actually, Katie, I have very healthy and positive view and relationships with women. Disagreeing and pointing out errors in logic and perceptions of reality isn’t putting anyone “in their place.” I guess some people have trouble seeing the truth clearly.

          And why the venom spitting about men older than you? “You do not have to date a divorced man, with kids, who is many many years older than you.” Despite your belated admonishments to the contrary, that is fairly derogatory and is definitely not saying that “it’s not her only option.” It’s flatly saying don’t do it.

          I never said that it’s impossible to find love and happiness and a relationship with childless single men your age or younger. It can happen. But it’s just less likely. You point to your long-term relationships with these men, including two broken engagements, but the point is, they didn’t last, did they.

          The other point is that the OP wrote in because she’s frustrated that she can’t successfully date or find a relationship with a single, childless man her age or younger. Simple cheerleading and “you go grrrrl” admonishments to “never settle!” are only likely to increase that frustration. For all this “empowering” backlash of “you can do better” at some realistic advice, I’d say “maybe, but maybe not” and “how long are you going to wait before you consider some perhaps harder truths? Setting her sights on men who are more likely to understand and be receptive to dating single moms is a more likely avenue to success and an end to her frustration than bland cheerleading.

          M asked for real answers about why she’s lacking in reaching her relationship goals and wanted answers about why men tend to avoid dating single moms with young children. Moxie and most commenters gave her some solid answers. Whether she or you want to accept it or not is your affair.

          I forget to mention that most times these comments are from other women.

          Oh, well, if it’s women that are telling you that, it can’t possibly be flattery and must, of course, be the truth…

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          • katie Says:

            wow, you really do not want me to look young, do you?…what a strange thing to focus on. I look a lot younger than I am. It is men, women, old young..teens..middle age, gay men……Pretty much every walk of life..when they find out my age, they are very surprised…Is everyone lying and trying to flatter me? I think not. And so what? It isnt something worth arguing about on here. Im not even into being shallow, but wanted to make a point and I did.

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          • katie Says:

            There are plenty of men who are cool with dating women with kids, in their 30’s and early 40’s. why do you say, I’m cheerleading? I gave examples of my personal experiences with myself, friends and acquaintances. I’m in a serious relationship with a never married, childless, partner at a law firm, who is 40. Not mid forties(and I would not care if he was 50 because I really fancy him). Sure, might be harder for her to find childless men who have never been married, but not impossible. That is the original point made. I only made that point, due to my past experiences. You do not want that to be true soooo bad, and also do not want me to look young…this is a strange site, with some very negative people indeed.

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          • katie Says:

            Also, I just noticed you comment on my engagements and relationships…I mentioned that I ended both engagements(and ended most of my relationships too), as I was not ready to marry..and did not want to marry these men. So what if I never marry? Better that than being divorced or settling.

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          • Mandy Says:

            LAST TIME I HEARD OF A CYBER BULLY, THE GUY WEIGHED 750 LBS AND LIVED WITH HIS MOTHER.. SO YEAH LOST SAILOR, I CAN JUST PICTURE IN YOUR MOTHER’S BASEMENT, TYPING AWAY BECAUSE NO ONE WANTS TO DEAL WITH YOU AND THIS IS THE ONLY WAY YOU KNOW HOW TO SPREAD THE HATRED FOR YOURSELF IS ONLINE.

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        • D'Alias Says:

          Yeah ok. Not a big deal to you or the kid who has to know how many people Mumzie slept with?

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      • katie Says:

        Oh yes, also, I did not mean for my comment, ‘you do not have to date a divorced man, with kids, who is many many years older’, as a derogatory statement towards these men, as if they are not as valued. I was simply making a point in that would NOT be the ONLY dating scenario she could get, or that would be the ONLY type of man who would date her. That might be more realistic or easier to get for her, perhaps, but is not her only option, of course (: I have had two friends, both in their mid to late 30’s, who have children and married men with no kids- men who have never been married themselves. So, it can and does happen.

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        • Marshmallow Says:

          Katie, Do people really walk up to you and ask you how old you are on a regular basis? Or do you ask them to guess (if so, please stop doing that as it is obnoxious)? I can honestly say that the only time it comes up for me is when I’m at the doctor’s. No one else cares.

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        • mindstar Says:

          Katie what you don’t seem to be acknowledging, and what Moxie, Lost Sailor, D and other commentators here have said, is what strategy is most likely to result in the OP achieving the relationship goal she is seeking?

          She can continue down the path she is on now, seeking younger men or men her own age who will not mind her having a child from another man. A path which she herself admits is failing. Or she can seek to date men older than her with children of their own who will be more likely to want to date her.

          Yes there are cases where some women do win the elusive brass ring and get the rich, hot, buff, younger guy with the great job, apartment on Central Park West and the summer home in the Hamptons, who just can’t wait to settle down with a single mother 10 years older than him. Granted these cases are usually in Lifetime movies or the latest romance novel but I will acknowlege that in very rare instances they can happen.

          What you don’t acknowledge is these cases are extremely rare. They’re long shots. It’s like playing roulette. I can take a chance and bet on single individual numbers and hope for the big 36 to 1 payoff or I can bet on Odd-Even or Red-Black and have a 50-50 shot at winning.

          The OP can continue playing the longshots day after day and year after year. Maybe she’ll win but the odds and reality say otherwise.

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        • Eliza Says:

          Katie – you are missing the entire POINT…what is being conveyed is that it would benefit the OP’s sense of frustration if she were more open-minded and consider widening her options by dating older men with children, who can relate to her – and her lifestyle. That’s all being suggested here. Nobody is stating that it is IMPOSSIBLE for the OP to perhaps get involved with someone childless and her age or younger, but it may be less likely – for obvious reasons. Lightning does happen though for some of us. “Never say never”. And that means – never rule anyone out–including older men in this case. As for the typical mantra – “I look/feel 10 years younger” – or “people tell me all the time”–only people who feel insecure about their age, will go on and on ranting about this subject. It’s unecessary.

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  12. katie Says:

    Also, to that earlier poster that made the comment regarding how women do not look ten years younger than their age(especially, the ones with children….), I must disagree. I am 36(almost37)but get asked, quite frequently, if I am 24 or 25, so I suppose that would be 11 or 12 years..I have always looked young and have seen others who look very young for their age as well. Not that it is a big deal, but just making a point… This view is subjective, of course, but I believe to be skewed on your part. Anyway, look at Isla Fisher, mom of two kids, right? She could pass for a 21 year old!

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 13 Thumb down 52

  13. M Says:

    This is quite interesting as I was not going to reply but now I kind of have to. Ok so first of all, just because I have a kid doesn’t mean I was married before, I have never been. I spent my 20s, apparently my good years, with the same person who was the love of my life, unfortunately he passed away unexpectedly, (however he is not the father). My son’s dad is actually 20 years older than me so that should make it clear that I am not bias to age. The younger man I dated, as I clearly stated was the first for me and most likely won’t happen again, as a matter of fact, I was the one who broke it off with him. I also left my son’s father because he turned 180 on me and became abusive. Let’s see..after that I put myself through school to get a degree so I could provide for myself and my child. I did not date for 4 years because of just that. Now I have more support in my life and me and “baby daddy” are on good terms. I’m not a washed up woman, I take extremely good care of myself and I do it for me, not for any man. My question was simply, what is the issue with dating with kids? Yes this is new to me and I just needed some input and I do appreciate all the honest answers on here but at the same time I don’t think it’s necessary to bash me either.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 22 Thumb down 32

    • katie Says:

      Do not pay too much attention on here as far as the men saying that you need to ‘settle’ and be ‘realistic’ in your only market for men being older, divorced men with children..not saying that is a bad choice, but just know that you have many options, especially, if you look very young, like you say. Plus, men that find out how you worked hard to put yourself through school, while raising a child will respect that(the ones who have good character and are interested in you, of course). It seems like some of the posters on here take things out of context and are very quick to jump on others(women) and have a ‘put you in your place attitude’.

      Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 11 Thumb down 61

      • ATWYSingle Says:

        Yes, and they’ll also learn that she got pregnant by some dude 20 years older than her. Hi. Massive poor judgment red flag.

        How young she looks is irrelevant. How young she is is what matters. 40 year old men can effortlessly get a woman 30-35 to marry them and have their children. They don’t have to entertain a woman of 37 who already has a child with another guy. Most men don’t want to support the child of another man if they don’t have to.

        You’re flipping out, and while it’s entertaining to read, you’re not a guy. So, sorry, but your opinions don’t carry the weight you think it should.

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        • M Says:

          I find that very rude. You actually sound like a real jerk. I was in a relationship for 2 years with my son’s father, I didn’t go out and get knocked up by some random dude. Also I don’t just date guys and let them meet my son, that does not happen easily so thanks but I am not looking for another man to financially support me or my child. I can respect that a man/woman does not want to date someone with kids and I get that all people don’t like kids. I certainly appreciate your opinion because that is what I ask for, I just dont get the whole womanizing issue here?

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          • ATWYSingle Says:

            I apologize. That did come off a bit harsh. However, the basic premise of what I said stands. A lot of people, when they hear you were dating a guy twenty years your senior and got pregnant, will speculate and make assumptions and wonder why you’re not with the father of your child. That’s just how people are. Some will internally judge you, some will come right out and say it.

            You and katie both keep ignoring the fact that your intentions don’t really matter. It doesn’t matter that you say that you’re not looking for a guy to support your child. Inevitably, the guy will end up supporting your child in one way or the other. Not only that, but dating someone with children is a hassle. You don’t really seem to be getting that, either. I just got out of something with a man with kids, and it was a herculean task at times. It’s not fun. Sorry, but it’s not.

            This has nothing to do with womanizing, though I think you’re misusing that word. This is kind of how it is. Men are telling you as much, and you’re sticking your fingers in your ears and yelling, “La la lalala I am not listening!”

            Seriously, whet the hell is the big deal about suggesting that a 37 year old woman date men in their mid-forties? What’s the problem?

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        • katie Says:

          I’m not ‘flipping out’. Just making valid points. Another typical misogynistic comment to jump and accuse a woman of being ‘irrational’ and ‘flipping out’, while the men’s comments are just as(if not more heated in response and ‘flippage’). What difference does it make if she made a ‘bad judgment call’, at 20? People change…grow up, mature, get smarter, get educated…who are YOU to judge? What a hateful thing to say. Quite frankly, if she met anyone so judgmental, then I would hope she would run the other way, anyway. After all, who likes judgmental people? Would you prefer a woman, in her early 30’s who had a string of abortions, or marriages, throughout her 20’s? My ex fiancée told me, himself, that one reason he liked me and respected me so much was because ‘he’ thought I did the right thing by not having an abortion(this is his opinion, not mine before people get on the abortion topic).

          Actually, how young someone looks in relevant..not sure your reasoning there. Someone’s looks are the most important thing according to some men, lol…Your comments are quite entertaining as well.

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          • ATWYSingle Says:

            Would you prefer a woman, in her early 30′s who had a string of abortions, or marriages, throughout her 20′s?

            Do go on about how misogynistic and judgmental everybody else is. I love watching women like you trip over your own hypocritical bullshit.

            Also? You may wish to keep the fact that you were engaged twice to yourself. That isn’t as flattering as you think.

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          • katie Says:

            I only go on about misogynistic people, when I encounter them, which isn’t that much, in real life, but behind computers..the bitter men feel free to ‘let it all out’.

            Not sure why…lol, what does being previously engaged convey? Is it worse than previously married(or, divorced once or many times..like many of these posters suggest she ‘settle’ with?). Hypocrisy..well, that might be projecting on your part, I am afraid, hehe. I would much rather date someone who was engaged, and decided to walk away before a bad decision was made, versus someone who has been married multiple times, with different children with different ex-wives, who just jumps from one marriage to another(just an example..please, do not take too literally, lol).

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          • katie Says:

            Oh my, you are a woman..lol..ATWYS..lovely. Anyway, nothing wrong with suggesting she date mid-twenties..I was making a point that is NOT her ONLY option. And, I get a lot of negative backlash for it. You sound like a mean girl AWTWYS…No one likes those- men or women(except the mean bitter ones on here.

            Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 4 Thumb down 57

          • katie Says:

            oops..typo, I meant nothing wrong with her being suggested to date md-forties…Just that is not a very nice way to get your point across ATWYS.

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          • katie Says:

            I wasn’t saying that I was judging women for having abortions or being previously married, but comparing your harsh judgment of her getting pregnant by a man 20 years her senior…I was trying to point out YOUR hypocrisy in the situation. I try not to judge people, but do hate misogynistic people, especially the female sort. It is sad, really for you…

            And by the way Anndthatswhyyouaresingle…..why are YOU single, since you mentioned the hassle of dating a single dad and it not working out…Is that from a long time ago, or are you still single and not married? You love pointing out other’s perceived flaws..Is it meant as an oxymoron, or an example of, ‘those that don’t do, teach’…I thought relationship advice was supposed to be taken from those in sound relationships? ;) hehe..just calling you out..not judging, of course.

            Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 51

          • BostonRobin Says:

            Well, that took long enough. I was wondering when someone was going to mention Moxie’s relationship status. That is this blog’s version of Godwin’s Law.

            Moxie’s advice is SOLID. It’s real. It has worked well for me.

            And WHY do people keep going on about looking ten years younger? People tell me I look ten years younger, and you know what I say in response? Something along the lines of, “thank you, but actually, I believe I just look good for my age. It’s a combination of genetics and good diet.” Or I may joke about how they haven’t seen me at five in the morning under a fluorescent light. I don’t want to feed into this adoration of youth that our culture has. Yes, it’s great to be young, but it’s even greater to be happy and healthy with who you are no matter what age.

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            • Eliza Says:

              Boston: Perfect! Couldn’t have said it better. I loathe to hear those ignorant words “I have been told I look 10 years younger, bla bla bla”…please don’t bore me with such insecurity and low self-esteem. Why is what OTHERS perceive or think of one’s age/looks so important. Who cares. Again, the bottom line for many is: How OLD are you biologically. And this may be derived from men or women who are looking to start a family…or for a mere ego boost. It is what it is. ANYTIME I have met a man that claimed he looked 10 years younger, bla bla bla, “you’ll see”…I workout, eat right, bla bla…I have ALWAYS disagreed! They either looked their age, or older. Never did they actually look 10 years younger. It’s all subjective. Thank you Boston. So annoying to hear such age-related remarks about one’s own perceived youthfulness. It makes people who say this come across as delusional.

              Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 12 Thumb down 4

          • mindstar Says:

            Katie you by your own admission are also single. Pot meet kettle.

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    • D'Alias Says:

      I’m confused as to how this is a question for a 37 year old. If you really don’t already know then I think you should go to therapy to help you figure out what’s going on with your emotional intelligence deficit. I dont mean to be a jerk but the answers/concers just seem so Obvious that if you don’t already know them I think that’s a real problem. (which is diff then understand them and just disagreeing).

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  14. Tinker Says:

    I do my best to avoid dating guys with kids because:
    – it’s too restrictive
    – there is always the kid’s mom to deal with
    – I can’t be prioritized the way I’d like to be
    M I don’t think you need to necessarily date older, just focus on guys with kids. They are more familiar and comfortable with the whole parenting thing and all of the unique circumstances it creates.

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  15. katie Says:

    Also, not looking for marriage or a man to take care of my son and I..I have had that opportunity, as I mentioned, but make quite a bit of money at my job, so can afford to be picky. I am in a relationship for some time now, but no hurry to marry. Not sure where you got the assumption I was looking for that. I have an advanced degree, as many women do these days, so women(and single mothers) are not as desperate for men(as providers)as you seem to portray ATWYS.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 9 Thumb down 50

  16. katie Says:

    Here is an example of ATWYS being hypocritical, per her post…

    ”Women need to stop saying they look young “for their age” or how everybody thinks they look 10 yrs younger. Stop being ashamed of your age.”

    It is hypocritical because you made all these comments regarding how a man, in his 30’s and early 40’s, would never want to settle down with a single mom, in her late 30’s, and should focus on men who are ‘at least’ 45. To me, that is trying to ‘age shame’ these women..maybe, they will start lying about their age, so they can get a man who is close to their age..lol

    How is looking younger than your age and being pleased about the fact being ‘ashamed’ of one’s age..what if they workout, eat healthy or even just have good genetics. Looking and feeling younger than one’s age(and having people tell you so and being happy about it) does not equate to being, ‘ashamed of one’s age’. Quite the opposite, in fact. Most people who look many years younger than their numerical age are quite proud to tell people their real age, in that they get a surprised reaction, when people find out. What is wrong with that? I would say the ‘ashamed’ of one’s age might be a better question to ask Hollywood, as it is gender and aged biased. You must look your age or older, since you made such an asinine comment.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 44

    • Greg Figueroa Says:

      For someone who doesn’t care about comments, you are sure so dedicated to responding.

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      • katie Says:

        it is entertaining tonight…home with bad cold.

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        • Kay Says:

          I hope your imaginary 40 yr old partner in a law firm boyfriend is taking good care of you.

          I love when women hang on online forum boards on Friday nights lying about why they aren’t out on dates.

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          • katie Says:

            I just mentioned I am home with a bad cold. He is in, Dubai…but on that note, why are you home on Friday night? You sound like a swell person.

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          • katie Says:

            Also, even if I didn’t have a boyfriend and hung out on online boards, then so what? What are you saying? You are here on a Friday night, so what is your point. Stick to the OP topic. I don’t think she wants personal attacks on me..on her question board.

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          • katie Says:

            Well, looks like the mob mentality has set in, so this is not helping the OP. I wish you the best of luck OP, M…I would suggest going to another advice blog as this one seems to have a lot of bitter, single people on it. Xx

            Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 7 Thumb down 37

        • fuzzilla Says:

          **Hypocrisy..well, that might be projecting on your part, I am afraid,**

          She’s referring to you railing about misogyny while throwing other women under the bus (implying you’re “better” than women who’ve had a lot of abortions, or that women who don’t have kids must have obviously had lots of abortions) and using a man’s opinion (ex-fiancee) to legitimize your view.

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          • katie Says:

            I never implied I was better than other women. I was making a ‘point’ of others saying she needs to focus on older, divorced men with kids..then the ATWYS, turns around and judges her for having a kid with a man 20 years her senior. As if being married and divorced is somehow more ‘legitimate’ than her past situation. I disagree. You apparently did not read all the posts….and if I were you, I would not as it seems you have already made an opinion.

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    • Greg Figueroa Says:

      How does looking younger help in getting a serious relationship? Katie, you keep mentioning flattery as some badge of honor. Superficial compliments are nice to hear, but doesn’t mean anything substantial. Inevitably, everyone who says they look younger tends to want to date younger and are frustrated with the problems caused by the age gap.

      I love how a woman in her mid twenties never seems to crow about people saying she looks 10 years younger at 25-years-old.

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      • katie Says:

        I think everyone likes a compliment…I did not say that looking younger helps one get into a serious relationship, but it does get one noticed by the other sex(male and female). Ive heard women in their mid to late twenties talk about each other looking younger or older..I had people say that a lot at 25 and 26 that I looked a lot younger.

        You are right, though..it is shallow and superficial and does not really equate to any ‘meat’ in one’s life. Looks fade with time with everyone. It is finding that person with ‘good character’ , having a similar moral compass..and also being sexually attracted to them..to be honest, a man’s age and looks is not a big issue for me, but I wasn’t impressed with other posters telling the OP that she should only expect a certain type of guy to be interested in her.

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  17. katie Says:

    Well, looks like the mob mentality has set in, so this is not helping the OP. I wish you the best of luck OP, M…I would suggest going to another advice blog as this one seems to have a lot of bitter, single people on it. Xxo

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 7 Thumb down 39

    • M Says:

      Hey Katie. I’ve been reading this thing since last night and all day with all these people putting in their two cents and you know I did ask, however didn’t expect for the men/women to be so aggressive and rude. I really appreciate your input on my question and I guess women, nice women really do have each others back :). My question was fair because I am certain that I’m not the only woman out there that has this problem. Funny cause we are supposed to “settle” for second best but these ignorant men on here seem to think they can have their pick at any women no matter what their age is. Sexism at its finest indeed. I also get you with the man you’re dating, I work in a law firm and associates and partners are so busy, probably more so than a single mom so I get how that would work out beautifully. Good luck lady !

      Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 12 Thumb down 49

      • katie Says:

        No worries. I just do not like blogs that are so negative and nasty. A good advice site would be askemily.com(she too used to work at a law firm and gives very good, mature advice, without being so opinionated and negative)and even girlschase(which is a PUA site, so it is a mostly men site and the guys will give you honest answers, but the guys on there are actually pretty nice and do not get so aggressive and negative, when you write something that they do not like).

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      • AnnieNonymous Says:

        I question what kind of response you wanted. You wrote that men have trouble dealing with the fact that you have a kid. The men here responded that, yes, kids are often deal-breakers. Maybe you were hoping to hear that you were doing everything right and perfectly and that every guy who dislikes your kid is a jerk. That’s just not true. For what it’s worth, you seem to be somewhat opposed to dating men your age who have kids, so you’re not innocent of this manner of thought either.

        People over 30 who don’t have kids are childfree for a reason. Men who want children can go and have their own. There’s really no such thing as a man who wants kids but will settle for raising someone else’s. You didn’t mention whether you’d be interested in ever having more kids. If you’re not, you’re going to have a really hard time unless you look for men who already have their own kids and absolutely don’t want any more.

        Have you ever had a relationship with a good guy fall apart because of lifestyle things that had nothing to do with how much you loved each other? Kids is one of those lifestyle things. If so many people are stating that kids get in the way, you can’t deny it and call them wrong because it hurts your feelings.

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        • katie Says:

          Haha, she did not say that..I am the one causing debate on her post. The OP even said that her ex(the father of her child), is 20 years older than her, so OBVIOUSLY..she does NOT have an issue with age.

          The debate started when all I posted that her ONLY options were NOT MUCH MUCH OLDER, DIVORCED MEN WITH KIDS. I did not say that it would be easier to find men her age, without kids..but it was not impossible. I said this, because, well Ive had experience with it, myself, as well as others that I know.

          Also, the OP never wrote in her posts/(replies) that the men who did not want to date her, or to date single mums were jerks..she SAID that some of the responses were aggressive, misogynistic(well, I said that)..but she said, rude. And they are..rude..from seemingly, bitter, single people(or, grumpy married people), with small-minded, opinionated and quite ignorant and judgmental viewpoints. Sorry, not everyone that responded to her question rudely or in an unconstructive manner, but many did in their response. Sure, it is much harder for a single mom, in her twenties, to date men her age(without children), than probably a single mom in her 30’s or 40’s…but that does not mean people should tell her to give up hope(in a nasty way by being judgemental towards her situation). Isn’t the divorce rate, in the USA, at 60% now? Who is anyone to judge anymore, really? She got railed for claiming she did not want to date an older man(which, she did not even say), then, ATWYS, said she was a walking red flag because she had a child with a man 20 years her senior. Whatever someone says on here, is apparently met with contrariness. Damned if you do, damned if you don’t, I guess is the motto on this blog.

          How about this idea?? Isn’t it true that if you want to be successful, in business(and life, really), then you surround yourself with very successful people?..Also, if you want good relationship advice, wouldn’t you rather take that advice from people, who, well…are IN a good relationship or married? I did not even know the blog person, ATWYS, was a woman(since her posts are a tad misogynistic), but someone else commented that she is single, and in her mid forties(she sounds immature and like a mean girl, so no surprise she is single)? Sorry, I will take my relationship advice from somewhere else..like with people who are successful, and not some blog woman who has a big chip on her shoulder and is single(who writes about ‘andthatswhyyoursingle’ as if she even knows why, she herself, is single…..lol..

          .I have only been on this blog one day now, since im stuck at home pretty sick with a cold…but next time im bored and stuck at home, I wont go to this weird site..lol.

          Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 3 Thumb down 51

          • AnnieNonymous Says:

            Please stop responding to comments that are clearly not addressed to you. I wanted to know the LW’s side of the story, not yours.

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          • Bogey44 Says:

            Well, yeah, you’re the one who caused most of the debate and aggression. You’ve gone on and on about people being aggressive, judgmental, and misogynistic, but you were the one who called a male poster a misogynist and questioned whether he had healthy views and relationships with women because he disagreed with you. And the funny thing is, he didn’t even really disagree with you. You have acknowledged that it would be easier for her to date older men with children, but it was still possible for her to date a childless man her age or younger even if it was less likely. To which others said that it’s not impossible just less likely and since she seems frustrated and not having much luck she either needs to adjust her target audience or her expectations in order to stop feeling frustrated. You’ve manufactured all of the “aggression” and “misogyny” and have been downright aggressive and judgmental yourself. All because some guys (and gals, mind you) on the internetzzz didn’t agree with you.

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          • Eliza Says:

            Katie–the OP DID (past) not have an issue with age – at 17 years old – since she supposedly has a child that is now 20. At 17 – 20 yrs her senior would be 37 years old. But she seems to have an issue NOW, currently. Not suggesting that the OP should date a man that is 57 (20 yrs older than her today)–but just a man that is either in his late 30’s – who HAS children or consider men in their 40’s who again, have children. Anyone reasonable would agree. This is in no way being rude, or suggesting the OP is very limited. And I agree with Bogey44…Katie you are the one that comes across rather aggressive – and in need of anger management. Perhaps therapy? With respect to the constant ranting about “looking younger” comments – that were probably stated out of sheer courtesy. lol. Your bitterness needs to come down a notch or two, not good for the soul.

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      • Bogey44 Says:

        M, it seems like you asked a question and specifically asked for input from men and didn’t like the answers you got (or liked Katie’s answer better) and decided you’d rather listen to Katie and when objections were made to her points you and her decided to start throwing out the sexism and misogyny charges. You also seem to think that those who have advised you to change your target audience as advocating that you settle, which is also untrue. Let’s be clear here, if this post had been written by a single father the advice wouldn’t be “you go man, you can get any woman you want,” but rather the exact same advice that you’re getting. This is in no way a gender issue, and trying to make one is just an attempt to distract from the crux of the debate. It’s not helpful to you, nor to any woman reading this in a similar predicament to yours.

        “Funny cause we are supposed to “settle” for second best but these ignorant men on here seem to think they can have their pick at any women no matter what their age is.”

        ^So, you want to be seen as some sort of prize and don’t want anything that can be seen as a concern (your child) to be held against you (despite a lot of valid reasoning that posters, both male and female, have presented), but when told you should look for partners who also have children and are your age or a bit older that’s “second best?” If these “strikes” don’t count against you, why do they count against potential suitors? Talk about a double standard….

        Here’s the crux of the argument for going after men with children, your age and a bit older; the most common thing people bond over are shared interests and experiences. Being that they’ve gone through a similar situation, they’ll understand you and your point of view much better. For example, if you have a date with a guy with children and you have to cancel last minute because your sitter fell through, he’ll be far more likely to understand. He knows how difficult it can be to find a sitter, how you won’t trust just anyone watching your kid, etc. However, a guy with no children could take that as you playing some kind of mind game. Rightly or wrongly, he’s much more likely to misinterpret the situation because he has no first hand experience in your position. Dating is a numbers game, and it’s about maximizing your probability of success. The best way to do that is to go after options that have things in common with you, options that have similar life experiences. That’s what’s being advocated to you here, not settling on just any schlep whose willing to date you or any such thing.

        Here’s a hypothetical for you, let’s take a man who’s a devout Catholic. He abides by all of the tenants of his religion, including remaining celibate until marriage. If he’s looking for a relationship, where is he most likely to find a partner? In a bar or a club? No probably not, because while it’s possible that there are some women there that would accept the impact his faith has on his life style, they are few and far between. Even though he might be an all around good guy, good job, many attractive qualities, a lot of non religious women or women of different religions will dismiss him off the bat because of his faith. Is it fair? No, not always. Is it the way things work? Yup, pretty much. So, what’s he to do if he wants to find a relationship? Either abandon his faith (unlikely just as you are unlikely to “abandon” your child) or find a place where he can meet like minded women such as church groups, Christian dating sites, etc. If he came here and asked for advice on his situation from women and that’s what they told him, what would you think if he turned around and cried sexism because he didn’t like the answers he got? You’d think he’s pretty off base, right?

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      • LostSailor Says:

        Well, M, it’s clear now that you really didn’t want an answer to your question, since you don’t seem to like the ones you’ve received, considering them “aggressive” and “sexist.” As the song says “you ain’t gonna learn what you don’t want to know.” These responses were only “negative” in the sense that they told an unpalatable truth that dating is hard for single moms approaching middle age instead of providing “you go grrrl” support.

        Clearly you were looking for reassurance and validation, which you got from another 37-ish single mom who thinks that 37-ish single moms are just fabulous and if you are frustrated by not getting quality dates from quality men because you’re a 37-year-old single mom with a young child, it must be the fault of those shallow men who just don’t seem to appreciate how fabulous you are. I’m sure you and Katie will be very happy together…

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      • wishing u well Says:

        Listen – children are a responsibility and your first priority. Be glad that the men who are not interested in being involved in their lives aren’t dating you. Your children deserve to be treated as more than an afterthought.

        We all have to learn to identify and like the people who truly like us for who we are, regardless of where you fall on the spectrum. That’s how you win in dating. Aiming for someone who isn’t all that into you sounds like a great way to work on the path towards divorce # 2. (Yes, a bit exaggerated – but you get my point). If you find that you keep striking out, it’s time to vary your game.

        And as far as Katie goes? “The lady doth protest too much, methinks.” Went way too far to oversell her point. I doubt her relationship is as idyllic as she’s shouting that it is. I wouldn’t take her too seriously were I you. Anyhow, congrats on getting back out on the dating scene. I wish you well.

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  18. Chester Says:

    Well, this might be late but I will give 2 more reasons for the difficulty dating someone with kids let’s say you’re now long term and you marry the girl.
    1. What’s the family thanksgiving holiday like? Well, the father gets the kid until 5, then he comes over with the kid. Christmas, not home holiday there either…you can’t even pretend you have a family life. dating a widow would be such an advantage over having this ex around forever.
    2. I know two men who committed to women with kids…after 10 years, the children are now volitile teenagers who caused a rif in the family. Mother is closer to child and divorces husband. This is a 10 year time bomb waiting to go off. No one is doing a study on this but I suspect this happens more often than not.

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  19. Kira Says:

    I’m 36, divorced and have children. I’ve just barely started to date again since the divorce was finalized in the summer.

    First, a note about looking younger: I’m finding it’s nice to hear but not helpful when it comes to meeting men in the wild. I don’t feel I look any younger than other women my age, but I’m routinely mistaken for 24-30 (darker venues with more alcohol can be blamed for the lower numbers, I imagine). So the guys who strike up conversations with me and ask me for my phone number are typically the age they believe me to be. Then it’s awkward because while I can recognize that these guys are younger than me, they don’t realize I’m older, and so I subtly bring up my age and mother status so they can have a dignified out.

    I have gone out with younger, never-married, child-free guys but went into it knowing with 95% certainty they would never consider anything serious with a woman my age, with children. I’m pretty awesome, but I think it’s a lot for someone with no children to undertake. Hell, I think a man with children might add up how many kids we’d have together if things worked out and realize he’s not up for a Brady Bunch type marriage, either, and instead search out a woman with just one or no children.

    I’m perhaps the opposite of the OP in that I’m having a hard time believing a man of any age, with any number of children will really want to date me. It’s not sexist, I just know I have a busy schedule, I wouldn’t introduce a new man to my children for many months which would limit the time we could spend together, and I know guys will probably see dollar signs when they think about my children and the potential for living all together sometime down the line. The kids’ father provides me with ample child support so it’s not an issue at all of me needing to be provided for, but a guy meeting me for the first time will have no way of knowing that.

    OP, I think with “just” one child and your age, you’ll be able to find someone, but you will need to be prepared for men who simply don’t want to take a woman with kids or who will not consider you because they’ll calculate ahead and wonder if you’ll no longer be able to have more babies by the time you settle down.

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  20. Chester Says:

    Age…
    It’s funny how so many people say they look younger than their age and no one EVER says they look older than their age. How can that be? ;-)
    I remember dating this beautiful 37 year old who looked about 44. She kept saying how she looks much younger than her age. Eventually it got to me and I told her she was very beautiful but she looks her age. Well, I don’t have to tell you what a blunder that was and I will never ever tell a woman anything other than she looks much younger. If she asks to guess age, I will knock it down 5 or 10 years so I don’t get in trouble.
    I remember meeting older women at night clubs hoping they were really younger. Dark lights don’t show the age, but the guy is wishing and hoping the woman is younger and even tries to convince himself. They may see a thin waste and convince themselves, but they’ll try not to focus on the hands and other parts that give away the age. Other men just see older women as an easy lay and flatter them to get them in bed by saying how young they look.

    Women have really forced guys to say women look younger and it is funny that women now actually believe the lies they force men to make. 99% of women who think they look 10 years younger are living in a fantasy. (Just look at the women commenting here: 4 out of 8 responding look 10 years younger – that’s just crazy… how can 50% of women all look 10 years younger than their age???? Delusional.

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    • Marshmallow Says:

      People have this idea that you hit 40 and fall apart. Sure some people do but with all the great skincare and makeup we have available – not to mention plastic surgery, it’s a lot easier to keep yourself together for longer.
      In the end, it doesn’t matter. If a someone is hell bent on dating someone in a certain age bracket, they don’t have to settle for someone older with so many actual people that age to choose from. You are still your biological age no matter how much you try and deny it.

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    • Kira Says:

      This is getting very off topic, but I will just say that some people struggle with looking younger and don’t always consider it a positive. I have been embarrassed to learn coworkers or clients thought I was so much younger because I felt it meant I was not projecting a professional, mature enough image.

      Being divorced with multiple kids when people assume you are in your 20s carries a very different perception than being closer to 40 with the same stats; it’s less scandalous at my age. People treat me differently upon hearing how old I really am. I have a coworker who is 30 and for the longest time I didn’t understand why he was kind of aloof, almost rude, with me. Turns out he thought I was younger than he was, and didn’t like that I “acted older.” Once he found out I was, in fact, older, he started being nicer to me. I had two very young coworkers who thought I was their age (23 and 24) and they changed the way they spoke to me when they learned I had kids and am considerably older, I was viewed more as a superior than on equal ground, even though we held the same job. It truly bugged me they thought I was their age, as if I’ve not matured at all in over 10 years! It makes me seriously question how I come across. I’d prefer to date someone my age or older, also with kids, and I don’t want men in their 40s to perceive me as immature or think I’m too young for them or something.

      I have a baby face and I’m short/small and will never be considered beautiful, I’m perpetually cute. You know, like your little grandma.

      I would rather a guy tell me I look great/pretty than tell me I look young. Young can mean anything – I can look young but still be ugly. It can mean I look unrefined/unprofessional/not put-together/immature. And, as I said before, I don’t truly believe I look any younger than other women my age, so I am more perplexed than flattered to hear it, even though I hear it often. It’s a watered-down sort-of compliment.

      The young guys can stop expecting me to be super flattered they’re asking me out! I sometimes wonder what’s wrong with them that they have to age up instead of going out with someone their own age (if they follow up with asking me out when they hear how old I am) :) Or I assume they’re the kind of guys who’ll ask out any woman in the room who is breathing, just to see if they get any takers. That doesn’t feel special, whether they think I’m younger or not. I actively try to dissuade younger guys from asking me out. Two who persisted I went out with just for fun and research, reasons I suspect are similar to their own.

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      • katie Says:

        It sounds like you are down on yourself a little…let me say that looking young is not always a good thing, but is not as bad as you think it is…to be honest, I’ve been in the corporate world before I changed careers(finance). In this industry and many others(that are still male dominated), there IS age discrimination(which is why I suggested to ATWYS to address her age shaming to them instead of people who just feel and look younger than their age). However, in this sort of age discrimination, the older woman, and even the more advanced in her her career woman(and usually pay) is ‘let go’, and replaced with a younger(and sometimes cheaper, newer, most often, younger woman). I witnessed it a lot in my old job at a financial firm..a woman, who is over the age of 45, or a woman who looks old, will get passed over a job(time and time again, no matter her experience) 9 times out of 10, for a younger woman. I had the head of human resources tell me so herself…..I heard it on the radio today…It is harder for a woman, over 45(probably men too, but more so women) to get hired(even if the woman has a lot of experience). It might be a good thing, if something ever happens to your job one day. Im not saying it is right..actually, it is pretty f’**ed up, but it is another example of ageist American mentality, in corporate America.

        So….there are worse things that looking younger than your age. Still better than looking older, since many workplaces are ageist And, I’m sure you are not too horrible looking if young men are asking you out.

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    • katie Says:

      No one forces you to say anything..Just say ‘no comment’ or you do not like to play age guessing games. I was speaking of people who voluntarily offer comments of ‘what age I look like’. And, how it is possible to look much younger than one’s age. I am proud to feel and look younger than my age, but no ashamed of my true numerical age. I do not think the girl checking out my groceries is trying to have sex with me..I hope.

      No offense, but you sound like a real wanker, lol.

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      • katie Says:

        sorry, kira…that comment was meant for, chester the wanker..not you.

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      • Chester Says:

        Katie,

        There’s no reason to call Kira a wanker. Resorting to name calling is something most people stop at seventh grade. People are here to express their opinions and shouldn’t be subject to name calling just because you disagree with them.

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    • katie Says:

      No one forces you to say anything..Just say ‘no comment’ or you do not like to play age guessing games. I was speaking of people who voluntarily offer comments of ‘what age I look like’. And, how it is possible to look much younger than one’s age. I am proud to feel and look younger than my age, but no ashamed of my true numerical age. I do not think the girl checking out my groceries is trying to have sex with me..I hope.

      No offense, but you sound like a real wanker, lol.

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    • AnnieNonymous Says:

      When women say they look young, I think they mean that they look younger than other women *they know*. A woman who hasn’t had kids can look 35 until she looks 50. It also depends on the basic milieu wherever you live. In my city, the women are very into tanning and being beachy. Any woman who takes care of her skin and minimizes her sun exposure automatically looks younger than her leather-skinned peers (though not necessarily young for her age on a broad scale). I agree with the other commenter who says that a woman doesn’t look young unless the majority of the men who hit on her are younger than she is – young-ish men tend to pursue women who look close to their age.

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    • Eliza Says:

      Thank you Chester! Finally. It’s the truth, for fear of stating what women don’t want to hear – some men AND women will guess 5-10 yrs YOUNGER of course. Always go younger. Actually, if you really want a more honest opinion of how old you look or how fat or think you are? Ask a child! That’s right. Children have a way of being extremely frank. As adults, we are trained to be “polite” and compliment each other. And yes, in the ultra-dark settings of nightclubs…we all can deceive! LOL. Which is why, I usually suggest getting together during the daytime, shortly thereafter…this way – you can see in daylight how someone looks au natural…well almost.

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  21. Ken Besig Says:

    I want to pass my support, my love, my affection, my genes, my DNA,and my bloodline, on to MY children and I do not want to raise some other guy’s offspring. All the other problems you mention, the cost of raising another guy’s kid, the difficulty of dating and scheduling, and what you do not mention, the resentment of the birth father towards someone taking over his role as daddy, are of some value but only in a limited sense. I myself and I believe most men want their own biological sons and daughters to support, raise, love, and value and we want that one of a kind spiritual and blood connection to them.

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    • katie Says:

      you can still have your own children with a single mother, unless she has her tubes tied, or something else permanent of that sort. However, that is your right to not want to date single mothers, of course…It certainly is not for everyone, but I think you are only looking at the negatives…

      In regards the the other parent…in some cases, the biological father or mother might have passed away(I know of a 30 year old man who lost his wife to cancer and he is raising two girls alone). Also, in this day and age, many women are employed at high paying jobs(making more money than their husbands in many cases), as well as the biological father paying child support.

      Scheduling around a single parent is not so terrible, if there is only one child in question, and they are older(like in my situation..and my so, well he is just a great kid and is liked by pretty much everyone)…But, I can understand the scenario where you have a crazy ex-baby daddy, or some wild and crazy kid(or teen)…..Just saying that the situation is not always so grim..or, black and white.

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  22. Kent Says:

    In my experience the women who have to tell you that they’re often told how much younger they look never do and are fishing for comp0liments.

    ATWYS looks to be in her mid-to-late thirties. I was very surprised to hear her say she was in her mid-forties. Here she has photos to back up claims of looking younger than she is but do you hear her reminding people of how young strangers say she looks? No.

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    • katie Says:

      Umm, 8 people on here did not claim to look ten years younger…it was not, ‘hey, everyone…I look ten years younger!!…I’m sooo great and life is so grand!’ Umm, no, Kent, I brought it up because another poster mentioned, early on in this post, that it was impossible to look ten years younger than one’s age. I disagreed with that assessment…it seems you agree with me, in that you just said the blogger ATWYS, looks 10 years younger(although, I disagree and think she looks to be in her 40’s(according to you… in that pic she has up).

      Also, I do not hang out in nightclubs and have had men and women(of all ages) comment on my looking quite young(I do not ask or mention…they ask when my son is with me, or they find out I have a son because he is a teen…and they say this in the bright light of day and flouresent lighting) So what, though? I even gave an example of Isla Fisher looking 21..because she does…And, I have met the occasional man and woman who looks much younger than their age…I used to teach aerobics and there was this one instructor who looked 40..but he was 55…It has a lot to do with the pyhsical shape you are in as well. I suppose people hate me as I am saying all this because it makes me seem shallow and conceited, but honestly., I only brought it up because that poster said it was impossible, and I disagreed and gave my experience. And no, I do not go around stating how young I look in real life, as it is rude and I do not think about it much, but this is just some silly blog, and the subject was brought up by someone else, so who cares? Others keep bringing it up and taking it out of context. Let it go…..

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  23. Jonathon Factory Says:

    Whew.

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  24. SoCalLady Says:

    I’m a 33 year old single woman without kids; I’ve never been married. I wouldn’t dream of dating a guy with kids. Ever. I simply couldn’t live with the fact that his child/children would always come before me. To me it’s always seemed like someone else’s family – they’re all related while you’re the odd person out.

    Becoming a parent changes your life forever – including your dating life. I don’t know how anyone could fail to understand that.

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    • VJ Says:

      And yet, plenty of folks evidently Do misunderstand or ‘misunderestimate’ the costs, trouble, struggle and sheer energy and effort required of & for kids, from all parties involved. In M’s/OP’s case, as is increasingly common, she already was ‘kinda sorta married’, in a type of Common Law marriage relationship with ‘the love of her life’ for “much of her 20’s”. Good for her, and yet somehow they did not have any kids, right? And then, according to the math, she turns 30, finds some amenable ~50 YO, and has a kid by him @ 32 near the end of their relationship. “He’d done a complete 180 on her”, perhaps not wanting kids or becoming increasingly ambivalent about such prospects? Which puts her at ~37 dating dudes a decade or so younger, and coming away disappointed somehow.

      What’s wrong with this picture? It depends on what you want, and what you envision the future to be. If you want an involved dad or father figure to guide the lad as he’s growing up? That sort of guides you in one primary direction. (Very few non custodial, never married dads are all that involved with their kids lives to an extent that the married Or divorced ones are, no matter the age). However if you’re seeking a ‘last fling’ with that ‘hawt thing’ you met at the corner bar last night? Time is of the essence, and you’re unlikely to be able to be doing this for much longer, (ie. pulling in the much younger, childless and unmarried/never married guys).

      It really depends on what you want and desire. Alas and alack, very few women in their 20’s ever fall in love primarily with the ‘character’ of the guys they’re dating. It’s always about the looks firstly, then the status, and somewhere down the line, some assessment on items that would be more ‘family oriented’ traits. Fidelity, trustworthiness, honesty, generosity, agreeableness, openness, easy going in most situations, etc. You might look for it in a dog, if you were of a mind too, but in a guy? All is lost in favor of the ‘hot’ and the pursuit of certain preferred body types/dimensions/sizes over many otherwise vital behavioral characteristics. That becomes more important only in your 30’s, when you’re finally looking to ‘settle down’ and/or start a family. For the guys, it’s much the same thing. But as we’ve heard above, there’s yet another twist on the assessment. Not only ‘what does the mother of my [potential] children look like?’, (a genetic crap shoot always, but less so with a ‘prettier mom’). But also, what’s the ‘content of her character?’ Here as usual, it’s hard to tell. For women in their 30’s? Most of them are now bearing kids out of wedlock, which again complicates all other considerations in many dimensions. If you’re a guy who’s somehow remained unmarried & childless until you’re 30 something? You really typically have more options to consider than the ‘usual’ run of the mill situation where you’re playing the game with one (or frequently more) baby daddy’s and all the likely ensuing drama, troubles, expense and heartache. And here, and likely in many other situations too, all for the prospect of raising another man’s child, And assuming the primary responsibility for the raising of that child for the rest of their lives. That’s not only a costly proposition, but an extremely taxing one, energetically and time-wise too. It’s also more likely that M will not want or be able to have more kids of her own, thus consigning this ‘new’ dudes generosity to the raising, care and feeding of another man’s child.

      So again, it’s not an uncommon predicament here. At the end of her yes, ‘reproductive career’ (we’ll take that @ or about 40-42 without extraordinary medical intervention), M/OP seeks to find a comfortable situation of acceptance of her ‘ready made family’ and aid and assistance in raising her now yes, teenage child. Think about that. What guy’s going to walk into such a situation with open arms and loving gratitude? Likely someone older, with kids of their own. And that’s what the stat’s will also tell you. So you can either go with the more likely scenario, (which is the way to bet), or hold out for some sort of ‘perfection’ or a ‘better deal’ (however defined for You) and try and hold onto the dreams you had in your 20’s. I know I’m not the same person I was in my 20’s. In many ways I’m a bit better, in a few others fairly worse. I know more and I’m wiser & richer. From long experience I’ve found this does not attract the ‘younger set’ as anyone might hope. Character is one thing, looks rule the realm for ‘dating’ though. So again, ask yourself, ‘What is it that I want and truly desire?’ If it’s another round of ‘fun with the young’ (again however defined), you’ve got one answer and one path. If it’s someone with some maturity and the knowledge, wisdom & caring concern to actually be able and willing to raise kids moderately successfully? That’s yet another path. The decisions you take now, then & in the future are Path Dependent, and will determine which choices can/will/might arrive more often or at all. In other words? You can and might just ‘hold out’ for that ‘perfect’ man, and ‘Never Settle’! And then indeed find him (again)! But perhaps you’ll be a lot older, and only enjoy that bond for a few spare months & some magical golden moments, right before you’re both separated by family for being publicly incorrigible & ‘outrageous’ in the nursing home you once shared! Cheers, ‘VJ’

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  25. msM. Says:

    just my two cents.
    I’m 34, female, never married, no kids. I have, let’s say a sexual preference (I’m dominant) that makes me popular, much popular than I ever thought I really was, via online dating. I have always liked and dated older men, and my profiles indicated that. (my age + 14 years older) As a result, I got a lot of responses from divorced dads and worse, divorced dads with full custody. I also got responses from successful childless men around my age. I guess I thought I was “too old” to get the truly available and baggage-free guys, and let me tell you this: all this comes down is options.

    1. there is no way in hell I am ready to be a live-in step mom to someone’s else’s kids. It’s not just the money, it’s a hell lot of responsibility (applies to men as well).

    2. I assume full-custody dads want a baby sitter, a cook and a sex partner, but that is not something i am interested in doing personally because I am getting a lot of responsibility for what in return? This person’s life is already set, mine isn’t. Maaayybbbe if they were REALLY wealthy and could pay for house help, nannies, cooks, etc…but realistically that just means WORK. Raising a child = work & money.

    3. Divorced men want wild sex more than anything because many are sex-starved and have fewer options. I’m fine with the sex part, but they have to give me something back (commitment, resources towards a future, etc…), and the reality is that divorced men have compromised assets and all their money goes to the kids. That means I am #2. As should be. But most single people with no kids want to be #1 in someone’s life.

    4. In the end I realized I HAVE OPTIONS and I am sticking to the younger guys with no kids because I can. There, I said it, I CAN. I assume that is true for most of the men this woman targets. Like me they have options. They can choose. And they do choose. My advice for her is to meet people through friends and NOT online. Because those of us online who have choices will exercise them. I don’t “look younger” and I don’t want to date people my age necessarily. All of this happened once I realized I HAVE OPTIONS. OPTIONS ARE POSSIBILITIES THAT ARE PRESENTED TO ME BY INTERESTED PARTIES. They are different from the opinion I have of myself.

    That changes everything. There is a difference between you thinking you should get younger guys and them not contacting you. That just means you don’t have options, they’re all in your head. Deal with it. It’s a fact.

    5. Bottom line= raising someone else’s kids NEVER sounds good on paper. Deal with it.

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  26. TR Says:

    Sorry, don’t want the emotional baggage, and certainly do not want to raise, support, or pay child support for kids I did not rear! It’s that simple.

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  27. Brattle Says:

    Wow…I find this whole thing and the comments following incredibly offensive and insensitive. What about women who were widowed young? My own husband died when I was 30 and I am raising our twin daughters (who were babies when he died) on my own. So I’m going to penalized for something that was beyond my control? To all those small minded naysayers out there…wait until it happens to you…

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    • LostSailor Says:

      Being offended won’t help. Nor should you think of it as being penalized. And you kind of miss the point. It’s not that there’s no one out there for you, it’s just that a certain group–single, childless men, especially in your age group–are going to be less interested in dating single mothers, or widows, with children. Are they being “insensitive”? No, they’re looking out for their own best interests, and why shouldn’t they?

      There have been a lot of articles and sentiment recently that these single, childless guys should “man up” and marry single moms. But those guys are saying “no.” It’s not insensitive that they’re catering to your best interests, it’s sensible.

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  28. A to the F Says:

    There are two main reasons why, one of which has been talked about, one that hasn’t, and I can’t believe no one else has said anything about it: how to put this gently, the lady parts aren’t ever the same after kids.

    Sad fact of life but very true.

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    • gossiprag Says:

      you are disgusting

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    • Sherry Says:

      What if the woman didn’t give birth to any of her kids vaginally? Keep in mind that the Cesarean section rate is sky-high in the US.

      If the doctor made an incision to mom’s abdomen to deliver the baby, her vajayjay has not been stretched out since an 8-pound infant has not ever passed through her birth canal.

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      • A to the F Says:

        Why am I disgusting for pointing out a fact of life? The truth can neither be mean nor nice, it’s but the truth.

        As to women who have cesareans, sure if the guy’s dick is two inches long, then it might be okay, but it’s not just the birth canal that gets misshapen with pregnancy; the entirety of a woman’s insides change and hollow out. The entire experience is different post pregnancy. Sure, it eventually reverts to some degree but that process takes years and it’s never the same.

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      • A to the F Says:

        And sky high? I wouldn’t call less than 1 in 3 sky high.

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  29. UnusuallyPatient Says:

    I have been dating as single mom of 2 young kids for about 9 1/2 months now, (-3 months last summer when she got scared and left me to figure things out). I am very much in love with this woman, and I love her kids too. Her kids adore me as well. It has not been an easy adjustment for me. I was with one single mom in the past, but it was a FWB relationship, and the kids were never involved. I can tell you, dating a single mother is NOT easy. It takes an insane amount of patience. You are not even in the top 5 on her priority list, or even top 10 as in my case. She won’t have a lot of time to give to you, so it can be lonely at times. There will likely be very limited opportunities to be alone together, or be intimate. If an active sex life is important to you, go ahead and leave now. Not gonna happen. So, with that in mind, Hostorically, in a relationship, I love spending time with the woman I am involved with, and I am a sexual person. So, you may ask, what the hell am I doing involving myself with a single mom, who is unable to spend much time with me at all, alone, or with the kids, and has limited time, or desire for a sex life. Believe me, I have asked myself that many times. The answer is simple. I love her now more than I have ever loved another woman. How is that possible? Well, I don’t know, but it is what it is. She stole my heart. Her kids stole my heart. And here I am, trying to be the most patient, understanding man on the face of the earth. Part of it I guess, is that I am hoping that as time goes by, the relationship will get better, and I will move up the priority list, and get more time with her. Only time will tell. And I’m still here.

    So the moral of the story. If you are single man with no kids, and you want to date a busy single mom, and want it to work. You have to be more patient and understanding than you ever thought was possible. If you absolutely can not handle that basic requirement, then honestly don’t waste her time, or yours.

    – If you need to be the center of her attention, or even close to it…..Move on

    – If you need to hang out with her all the time, or even more than a couple times a week at best……Move on

    – If you need sex with her every day, or even every week for that matter………Move on

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  30. SuzyQ Says:

    To Bogey 44

    The part about “Why would a woman get involved with someone who has no interest in taking care of his kid? What does that say about her character and judgment?” SHOULDN’T YOU BE ASKING THE FATHER WHY HE HAS NO INTEREST IN TAKING CARE OF HIS KID AND WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT HIS CHARACTER AND JUDGMENT? —actually I would much rather have something to do with a woman with a fatherless child who you could adopt and love…THE ACTIONS OF A FATHER NEGLECTING HIS OWN FLESH AND BLOOD HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE WOMAN….HIS ACTIONS=HIS CHARACTER.

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  31. George Says:

    There’s another aspect: Hard to believe, but it’s true, some guys actually care very, very much how a child feels. Being the center of a child’s hopeful dreaming or, conversely, jealous scorn is a heavy load to carry. No, a guy isn’t responsible from an adult perspective, but that’s not how it feels. Watch the Tom Cruise movie, Jerry McGuire, for an artful illustration of just such a guilt trip. It’s hard enough to gauge how a relationship is developing between dating adults w/o kids; w/kids, well, I just don’t know how anyone does it.

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  32. Northern_Guy Says:

    Single 50% custody part-time dad here. Two kids.

    My reality is that I get that most child-free women would not want to get with a single dad like me. I am also heavily involved with the ex still and we do a lot for our kids. I would not expect someone to tolerate that.

    So even if I get more boundaries with the ex (which will come in time) I have another problem. Courts are now getting men to pay child support for children that are not even theirs. So, if I go the “single-dad-with-kids meets single-mom-with-kids” when we break up (we probably will one day) I can be on the hook not just for MY child support and alimony but child support for HER/HIS kids and perhaps alimony for HER too!

    In a word, the risk is too high.

    I think I’ll just have friends, be a good dad, party a bit when the ex has the kids, maybe get a friend with benefits here and there. Just keep in good shape – there will always be women who will go for a fit, groomed, hygenic and handsome man – regardless of his circumstances. In fact, I find being a bit of a jerk helps… maybe I need some tatoos? It’s true. Women like bad boys and jerks.

    But as for the big “we’re in love la la la move in and play house”?

    Fuhgedaboudit. That ship has sailed. And I’d rather chew nails than pay for another man’s kids when I have my own to pay for. Groceries and living costs while we’re together is one thing – but paying for MORE kids (who are not mine) after another relationship goes south?

    I just can’t afford you liberating divorcing flighty foot-loose and fancy free women these days! Seems like leaving men is just GOOD BUSINESS for women these days! Part of the problem? Yeah, I think so.

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