If You Want To Date A Guy With Money, Just Admit It

The Frisky posted an article today that I thought would make for good discussion.prince-660

It’s your run of the mill listicle of all the guys the author refuses to date. Nothing too inflammatory. Except for this:

11. No Passport Man: If a man has reached his mid- to late-twenties (or older!), but somehow manages to have never had a passport, I’m moving on. While I understand that not everyone has loads of cash to spend on fancy vacations or exotic getaways, it’s pretty cheap to go to the postal service and fill out an application for a passport. That simple act demonstrates that a man is ready to travel, in the event his finances allow it. I love to travel,and a willingness to hop and a plane and GO is something I need.

Let’s isolate out the most telling line of this blurb:

That simple act demonstrates that a man is ready to travel, in the event his finances allow it. I love to travel,and a willingness to hop and a plane and GO is something I need.

Ahh. Now we’re getting to the core of the issue. But here’s the best part: just a few points later she says:

Many men define their manhood by their success or finances – blame society, I’m just the messenger.

Um..okay?

I’m not sure how a 25 year-old writer has the money to spend on frequent travels. She insists that she does, of course, and credits her freelance writing career. Because we all know writing pays so well and that living in NYC, where she lives, is so cheap, you guise! But …

 

A big reason why men define their manhood by their finances is because many women encourage that belief by constantly saying they want  a man who is “ambitious” and “financially secure.” Are we really going to act like many woman and their expectations aren’t part of that whole fallacy? Come on. Dating largely revolves around money, as in who makes it, how much they make, and who pays. And most of those expectations still, in 2015, fall on the men.

No, she’s not just the messenger. She insists upon dating a man who has the finances to be able to travel at a moment’s notice. Because that’s apparently a thing people do all the time. They just pick up and book a flight to Cancun or The Bahamas or London and jet off  a few days later. The author denies that her true concern is the man’s finances, natch. Nope. It’s all about having a passport, something she herself admitted is easy to get. Often times people need a fair amount of lead time before just taking off. So, what’s the big deal if they have to apply for a passport? It only takes a few weeks to get one. You can’t wait three or four weeks? That’s why I think the whole passport thing is a ruse for what is actually of importance to her and people like her who place travel high up on the priority list: money/status.

In order to travel at the drop of a hat, they’d not only need the proper documentation but the money to pay for the trip. Now, I don’t know about you, but when I travel (which is rarely – don’t passport shame me, bro ) it’s not often that I can just book a flight out. A trip  somewhere in the US for just three days is an easy thousand dollars between air fare and accommodations. Hell, going to Boston for a day costs me almost $500.  I pay for them with my debit card.  Not everybody can or even wants to put all of that on a credit card. Some people – people who earn a good living, even – prefer to save up for that so they can pay in full, and I’m one of them. I’m not nicking my good credit score just because I have an urge to go sit on a beach for 3 days.

Personally, I don’t really care if someone has traveled internationally or not. I don’t take that to mean they’re more sophisticated or cultured. I’m a bit of a rube. Even though I grew up in a fairly privileged home, we didn’t travel much. Other than when he went to war, my Dad never traveled outside the US. (Wait. No. That’s not right. He and my step-mother went to Aruba for their honeymoon. ) But other than that, he never left the US. In fact, I can’t remember him ever taking a vacation. There was that time he flew my sisters and I to Florida a few weeks after my mother died, but that couldn’t have been that much fun for him. His wife had just passed away. He really wasn’t the vacationing type, and as a result, neither am I.  I never developed an affinity or need for it. Like him, I was and am always working. It’s all I know. I also never had the money of the financial stability to travel until a few years ago.  Only recently have I really felt compelled to get out of sheltered little world and go see other places.

I often feel very inadequate because I haven’t traveled abroad. What’s funny is that I was traveling by myself at the age of nine well into my teens. Every year, my family put me on a plane by myself to fly out and stay with my aunt who lived in New York City. I tell that story now and my sisters are horrified and conveniently don’t remember sticking me on a plane by myself at nine years old to go stay with my aunt in the Bronx because they didn’t want to spend their spring break babysitting.  I’ve been to the West Coast a few times, down south twice, taken a train to DC and Philadelphia..but I’ve never been outside of America. I sit and watch The Graham Norton show and think, “Goddammit, you have the money – GO!” I don’t know what keeps stopping me. It’s not the idea of traveling alone, because I LOVE doing stuff alone. I don’t have any fears about that. Once the probate case is over next month (crosses fingers) I really need to book some kind of trip.  God, I would love to just fly off to London for a month.

I can remember the first time I told a guy I was dating – who was British – that I didn’t have a passport. He was very sweet about it, but I actually felt shame admitting it. I could absolutely see people holding that against me the way the author of that piece says she would do. Lack of international travel is seen as a lack of sophistication, and in many ways, they’re right. I am unsophisticated in certain ways. Someone who reads my book excerpts pointed out that the narrator had red wine in the refrigerator. Those are the types of things I just don’t know about, and it embarrasses me when I unknowingly reveal them. I remember my sister screaming at me just after my father died because I didn’t buy flowers to surround his casket at the funeral home. That’s a thing? Why did nobody tell em that’s a thing?? My family owned a funeral home and I didn’t even know this!

I think a lot of people attribute a level of status and success to being able to travel frequently. But here’s something I learned recently: those people constantly posting photos or updates about all those trips they’re constantly taking? Yeah, usually those people who are traveling some place new every few months are marginally employed and blowing through their savings or maxing out their credit cards. While there are several reasons for this, one is so that they can post pictures on Facebook of them enjoying their super jet set lifestyle and pretend to be successful. Meanwhile, they’re barely employed, making little to no actual income, and draining their bank account in an attempt to look posh. I’ll also add that people who like to play up their love of travel in their dating profile very often turn out to be people who travel maybe once every few years, if that. Unless it’s something you do with regularity, try not to oversell it just to make yourself sound more worldly.

I think placing travel as a priority as in making it a must-have and not just a thing you’d prefer when seeking a partner all boils down to one thing:  wanting someone who has the expendable income to do so.

So, yes, it actually is about the money, at least in part.  Let’s not pretend otherwise.

 

Thoughts?

Sometimes the love of your life is the love of your life. (R)

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29 Responses to “If You Want To Date A Guy With Money, Just Admit It”

  1. Bethany Says:

    I think traveling is really overrated. I enjoy going out of the country every few years but I don’t get all starry-eyed and romantic over the notion of traveling. I wouldn’t judge someone for not valuing it.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 16 Thumb down 16

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  2. headspacer Says:

    I’ve traveled a lot but I’m not a sophisticated traveler and would never shame anyone for not having traveled. There are a thousand more ways to polish and develop oneself outside of traveling abroad. One important thing travel teaches me is to overcome narrow-mindedness and understand that people live differently–that my way of life is not the only viable option. You could also easily get that from reading books (the ultimate form of traveling for the mind) and interacting with a wide variety of people.

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  3. Mel Says:

    I don’t have a passport, either! Anyone who would be judgmental over that is corny. People have different circumstances in life that may have not allowed them to travel, or they may just not have cared enough about it to go and do it. Who cares? Hearing about people’s travels can be interesting, but I’d rather find someone who places a high value on being aware of social issues, contributing to the vulnerable in society, etc. I don’t need someone rich who sits on a beach – or more likely, pretends to be rich. And Moxie, I don’t drink wine so I didn’t realize that about red wine not being refrigerated, either. I may have learned that when I worked in a restaurant a couple years ago, but I forgot.

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  4. Sarah Says:

    It is. It absolutely is. Also: Let’s all agree to stop perpetuating the myth that travel is a rite of passage — a transformative experience that teaches you so much, blah, blah, blah. It could be. But the only people I hear bragging about this shit are the people who clearly didn’t benefit enough from their travels, because I still don’t want to hang out with them.

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    • Kyra Says:

      I don’t think it’s the only possible right of passage , but I certainly think that travelling can be a transformation experience.

      Travelling on your own away from anything and anyone familiar, in my opinion, should be transformative. If you I learn nothing on my trip, then it should be considered a waste of resources and time.

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    • Kyra Says:

      I don’t think it’s the only possible right of passage, but I certainly think that travelling can be a transformation experience.

      Travelling on your own away from anything and anyone familiar, in my opinion, should be transformative. If you I learn nothing on my trip, then it should be considered a waste of resources and time.

      Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1

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  5. Kyra Says:

    I do actually consider travelling a priority in my life, but I can only manage to save up for a trip every two to three years. I definitely don’t think of travelling as just an excuse to sit on the beach, if I wanted to do that I could just drive to the lake.

    I would value a partner who likes experiencing the sites and history of another city with me, but I’d never be appalled at someone not having a passport (Despite that I think it’s an important asset to have, even just as an extra form of I.D. in case of an emergency).

    As for the money bit, if my partner can pay all their bills and aren’t a paycheque away from being homeless, then we’re fine. I don’t care if a guy is rich, I just want to know that he’s responsible with his money.

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    • BTownGirl Says:

      My foreign travel has consisted of Monaco and Sardinia – basically I just got drunk on beaches and at various casinos and gawked at jewelry/fancy boats, so I’m not judging anyone who hasn’t had such Transformative Life Experience ;). My feeling on a dude’s financial situation is that it has to be stable, but I admittedly got a leg up in life thanks to my grandparents being smarter than I’ll ever be, so I’m not dismissing anyone because they can’t to jet off to Europe on a whim. Hell, I have job responsibilities that make it impossible and charging up my credit cards/large outlays of cash for nonessentials give me anxiety, so why would I hold that against anyone else? Lastly and most importantly, I keep red wine in the fridge because I like it that way. DO YOU.

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  6. Sarah Says:

    I know it’s not even fair to critique this Frisky listicle, as the author is clearly a child. But.

    This whole “hop on a plane and GO” fantasyland fun time frolic? THAT’S NOT A THING. Financially solvent adults can’t or won’t do that because of trivial things, such as being essential at work, or, saving for retirement, or, hiring someone else to perform home repairs on the property that they OWN.

    Travel can be wonderful, or terrible, and is worth doing, regardless. But don’t complete the Basic Bitch World Tour of Western Europe and then look down on others for having fewer stamps in their passports. I’d much rather date the guy who has zero stamps because he’s been in America doing something useful with his time than the guy whose parents paid for a gap year so he could go to Amsterdam.

    Ugh. Done.

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    • maria Says:

      omg: “complete the Basic Bitch World Tour of Western Europe and then look down on others for having fewer stamps in their passports”

      hahaha best comment ever and totally hits the nail on the head with these kinds of people!

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  7. ShawninCo Says:

    I’m so tired of this (last minute) travel cliche. I couldn’t agree more that it’s veiled classist preferences. For the longest time, hearing statements like this made me feel like I wasn’t “ready” to date; this was my late 20s. There are so many people on Okcupid who brag about having been to 30+ countries – on mommy and daddy’s dime. And this is just 20 somethings and early 30 somethings. Then, I started asking my friends and analysing this crap.

    The people who said this either lied and could never (afford to) do it, made above average income and had very demanding jobs that demanded intense escape, or did it all on someone else’s money/credit cards (how the hell does this exemplify financial stability?). Either way, they’re too much work and lying to themselves.

    I’ve just started travelling abroad. Depending on how you do it, it’s a hell of a lot of work. If you just stay in the touristy areas that only speak English, then you can do that almost any where. You certainly don’t embrace the culture. If you actually embrace the culture and wrestle with the language, it can be wonderfully rewarding, but EXHAUSTING. There’s NOTHING sexy and glamorous about navigating a new country with a second grade vocabulary, but you learn wonderful things about yourself and a new culture.

    The dating world is full of people who measure what others have to offer against the lies that we tell ourselves. Maybe it’s human nature and we all have to fight against it. I think that a lot of us veer toward those out of our leagues to magically “prove” those lies to ourselves. The best people to date are the ones who are more humble and realistic. And, Jesus Christ, they’re not so uptight.

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  8. ShawninCo Says:

    As for the wine thing, I don’t think it’s that big of a deal. I love my wine too. At the wine bars that I frequent, plenty of reds are refrigerated. The ideal temperature is below room temperature and above the ideal temperature for whites. Some consumers use cooled cellars and mini wine fridges. Plenty of urbanites have room for them; plenty don’t. Those that don’t have room refrigerate it for a little before they serve. While I don’t know the commentary on it, I can’t fathom that refrigerated red wine’s a big deal at all.

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  9. Ben Iyyar Says:

    Let me first say that I agree that this lady has the right to impose any conditions or restrictions she pleases on her dating pool, but if this passport thing is a real deal breaker for her, I believe that she is facing a lot of future disappointment.
    This is because I cannot imagine what attractive, sober, and financially secure male, in possession of a passport or not, would be bothered with a woman who sees him as a “sugar daddy” whose purpose in life would be to finance her travelling needs.
    My suggestion for her is to be more realistic and less restrictive with her pool of potential dates, at least regarding her passport thing.

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    • Bill Says:

      ^^^ THIS ^^^ is how I interpreted it as well. Not only that he have a passport and travels abroad (which I enjoy as well), BUT is ready, willing and able to purchase two tickets… early in the relationship (at a whim) and frequently, thereafter.

      Typically, I’m willing to give the benefit of the doubt… on this one, I’m very cynical. Expected or demanded generosity it a turn-off and deal-breaker for me.

      Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1

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  10. jenny Says:

    I personally HATE travelling. I’d rather indulge locally than fly somewhere. I feel like 90% of people “travel” in order to brag about travelling. And writing “I love travelling” is about as off putting as writing “I’m a good looking guy” on your profile. In all likelihood you love telling people that you travelled.
    Even my husband, the first time I went to his apartment when we were dating, wanted to show me his pictures from India. And I was like “Ya, I don’t know who you were dating before, but I just don’t care.” (Maybe now that I know him better I’d have a tad more interest in the photos, but you get my point)

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    • maria Says:

      its your right to not want to travel an I wouldn’t really judge a guy on that, but some people travel because they, you know, like it. obviously this woman saying that she won’t date a guy without a passport means she won’t date a guy without a lot of disposable income and free time. aka a guy who comes from family money because having disposable income in NYC is pretty rare unless you are dating wealthy people.

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    • Kyra Says:

      I mean, it’s totally your prerogative to not see value in travel, but I think it’s a little bit… close-minded to say that people travel just for attention-seeking means.

      A lot of people travel because they like seeing different cultures and sights and interacting with people you wouldn’t normally interact with. What’s so wrong with enjoying spending your time exploring another city?

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  11. Snowflake Says:

    fyi…

    a person’s worth isn’t that they have a passport or not/or money… its the size of their heart… true story, and its something I have believed since I was a child, has zero to do with being young or what city you live in etc etc etc..

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0

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  12. maria Says:

    I do love traveling as much as the next person but this is probably the STUPIDEST reason to not date a guy. is this really what dating has come to? also, how on earth would you even know if a guy has a passport in the first few dates? I agree with Moxie, she’s using this to see if he has a lot of disposable income. Nothing more, nothing less. I refuse to listen to anybody over at frisky bitch about men anymore when this is the shit they are publishing.
    Most people I know simply can’t just pick up and travel because they work to support themselves. I have to give THREE weeks notice at my work and only get 2 weeks vacation time per year. not to mention that vacation can be very cost prohibitive. there is no way she can drop everything and just travel around the world and live in NYC from being a mediocre internet writer. her parents are clearly footing the bill and this article made it clear that she expects her man to do the same.

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  13. Grace Says:

    Tiffanie’s articles all contain a distinct yet unearned tone of entitled haughtiness. She might be able to take a vacation somewhere on a whim because she’s a freelance writer with no real responsibilities or ties. That she expects other people to lead such an uncomplicated lifestyle shows how immature she is. She thinks she’s so much smarter than everyone else but really is very simple and inexperienced. The list she wrote proves she repeatedly gets played. LOL at how she’s trying to make people think she affords all the trips she takes on her own. Girl, you tried.

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    • Mark Says:

      Interesting POV.

      I only read this one article, so I can’t comment on a general pattern.

      However, I did notice that she seemed to have a predisposition to classify potential dates and put them into little boxes. I don’t know many people who like to be put in little boxes. The thing is, almost all of these types are negative in characterization. If someone feels that they can come up with 25 “types” and almost all of them are negative, then that tells me something.

      If she were truly that perceptive, then she might utilize those powers of perception on herself to help her characterize herself. That is to say “How do others view me”. That might help her in her search.

      While I can appreciate someone thinking “I’m not looking for Mr. Perfect, just perfect for me” in their social life, then you had better be free of many of the foibles that she seems to find in so many others.

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  14. Sandra Says:

    I think people like the woman who wrote the article for Frisky just make up these ridiculous lists to provide content to the site and fill up space. I would be surprised if much of this sentiment is actually genuine, or just a fantasy persona she is presenting.

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  15. Joan Says:

    The only thing that I can say after reading that article is “The sugar baby has talked”

    She has the oh so holly right to set her own dating rules, have as many “boyfriends” that can support her travels needs and more.

    From this post I have learned two things, #1. I am, sort of, kind of sophisticated because I have traveled to other country. If moving from my original country to the US counts

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  16. Joan Says:

    #2.
    I just got my BIG box of red wine out of the fridge. I am sure now, I am not sophisticated amd and I don’t speak wine

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  17. Lisa Says:

    I’ve always travelled. I took my first transatlantic flight at 6 months of age. I enjoy it and love enjoying it w/ a SO. I’m not rich and wasn’t rich growing up. It has nothing to do w/ being rich. Food is a big motivator for me now. And architecture. But everyone who likes travelling has his/her own reasons. I wouldn’t rule anyone out bc he had never travelled (my current bf had only visited two other states prior to us meeting) but I might if he told me he would never, ever want to, even if money were no obstacle. To each, her own!

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  18. Mark Says:

    I found this interesting. I suppose that in some ways it addresses a number of points. Moxie and some of the posters above me highlighted some of them.

    I’ve traveled a bit. Not as many as some, but more than others.

    Funny thing is – There are some people who travel extensively, but in a very real sense never leave home. I’ve also encountered some people who rarely left their town/county but are more worldly than many people with a stamp filled Passport.

    Go figure.

    So if travel coupled with the quantity and nature of importance to someone, or at least it is seen as an indicator of some desirable character trait, more power to ‘em. If they are honest and up front about it, then that’s their prerogative. Whether or not you fit into that personal preference just makes things an easier go/no go for someone you are looking for.

    Again, interesting topic.

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  19. The D-man Says:

    I’ve traveled a fair amount, but I didn’t do any international travel until my thirties. I think travel is a bit overrated, but living somewhere different for a month or two is fantastic. Last fall I spent five weeks in Colombia and loved it so much I’m going back for all of June and July. I can work from anywhere as long as there’s wifi and finally am taking advantage of it.

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  20. Malienation Says:

    Don’t see the point of travel? Work with me here.

    You can spend your money on 3 things: options, objects, or experiences.

    Buying options means investing it and not spending it. That way you have more options with your life: you can quit a job you hate, you can take a long time off for whatever, you name it. Problem is, many people who buy options never use them. Suddenly, they’re 80 years old and too sick and tired to do anything but count their money. You can’t take it with you. And it’s true: on their deathbed, no one ever says, ” I wish I had spent more time at the office.”

    Buying things means, well, buying things. Gadgets. Shoes. Toys. They seem cool now, but soon they’re just junk. They’re ugly, obsolete, broken, or just boring. Tastes change. You’ll change. Then you’ll wonder what the hell you were thinking.

    Buying experiences means buying something with nothing but memories to remind you you bought them. Travel comes to mind. Think travel leaves you with nothing but a pile of bills? Wrong. I’ve got some great memories. Getting liquored up with another couple on Barcelona’s waterfront. Pounding down cannoli in Sicily. Climbing Mt. Etna. Seeing Michaelangelo’s David. Botticelli’s Venus. Tossing coins in the the Trevi fountain. Gondola rides in Venice. Yeah, there were disappointments (I’m lookin’ at you, ceiling of the Sistine Chapel). But I loved it.

    I’m not rich. I don’t mind living in a tiny house. If I had a nicer house, I couldn’t have gone where I’ve gone. As I see it, when I’m at the end of my life, I’ll have lots of great memories to rehash. I do this even now. When I’m stressed, I try to relax by thinking of Italy. London. France. Spain. Memories that are good get better with age. If I had a really nice house instead, what would I daydream about? How awesome it is to have granite countertops?

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  21. Speed Says:

    I’ve travelled a lot internationally since my 20s, mostly on business, a little for pleasure. I also took two multi-year overseas assignments and get by in three Asian languages. In my experience, travel is interesting, even profitable, but also way overrated. About 98% of Westerners I’ve met overseas don’t even have a basic grasp of local culture, history or language.

    Even for the long-term guys and gals, outside the office, it’s mostly about the bar scene (the ones with English-speaking staff that cater specifically to foreigners) and some tourist traps. Some 1-week temple stay or dining on live octopus and Soju/Sake at the beach does not make a person especially enlightened or sophisticated. It only means you’ve had Sake and octopus at the beach. You can probably get it in Manhattan if you look long enough.

    So, I always look askance at people who claim backpacking a month in Peru or visiting a temple in India or Thailand was “life-transforming” and hold up their noses at people who haven’t been. Things like raising children, serving your country, caring for an elderly parent, starting a business or charity: these are life-transforming things. Things that challenge you and change your outlook on life. They make you a full human being. Getting on a plane is not a special achievement, nor is walking through an ancient castle or Central American cave. Interesting, yes. Life-transformative, no. Peking Duck is certainly different in Taipei than LA. It’s the “real thing.” I can certainly recommend it. But it won’t change your life, no matter what Anthony Bourdain says.

    Overseas, if you spend enough time (and get out of the Western-centered areas) you’ll also see as much human bad (or even evil) as good. Great temples in Thailand, but also blatant human trafficking. You can’t notice one without the other. The idea that people in the Third World are leading some pure, mystical, earthy lives and have unique insights into the universe comes from Western superficiality, condescension and fantasies. “People here are so polite and open! I feel really connected to them!” It’s because you’re buying their trinkets, inn space and tours, not because they love you. Get over yourself! It’s a cliché, but after extensive travel you realize that basically “people are people,” just trying to get by in their own way.

    Most of all, travel is not a substitute for real, substantive character development, and people who think it is aren’t really grown up, in my book. And so people who fill their dating (or social media) profiles with selfies taken in Mexico City or Bangkok and hold that up as a unique accomplishment…well, they’re telling you who they are: they are flighty and superficial.

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