Dater X: If You Banged Him, He’s Not Just A Friend

September 1st, 2015

Article Roundup, Dater X, NEW!

Today’s Dater X post is up, so let’s dive right in.

I also don’t know too many women who can successfully have platonic relationships with men for a significant length of time. ..So while I have occasionally slept with my male friends (and no, not all of them!), they remain firmly in the “friend” category, which makes them about as much of a threat to my significant other as my female friends.

I’m not even able to follow this, it’s so fucked up. First, you adorable little speshul snowflake, it is not at all rare for men and women to maintain a purely platonic across the board friendship. Second, if you’ve slept with said male friends, they will never be “just friends.” Ever. You can tell yourself that’s the case, but it isn’t. I’m getting the impression that Dater X is one of those women who thinks having all these guy friends somehow elevates her above other women, like she’s being granted an access to their inner most thoughts that other women aren’t given. I’m getting a distinct “I’m Better Than Other Women” vibe from her, and I don’t care for it.  Somehow she’s magically able to maintain friendships with all these guy friends she’s banged while claiming she’s never gotten attached? Let me guess, she and each of these guys agreed that they were better as friends and that’s why they didn’t date, right?

Our [hers and El Guapo’s] fooling around was never especially tender, and I truly don’t think it ever occurred to either of us that we might be laying down the foundation for a relationship. It certainly never occurred to me.

Except it did occur to her, remember? She was trying to determine if they’re meet up to get drinks was a date or not. I have no doubt it never occurred to El Guapo because – sorry – I never even got the impression he was all that attracted to Dater X, let alone interested in a relationship. She’s now talking about El Guapo like he’s never been anything but  a fart joke telling buddy and not the guy who squeezed her ass at the bar and said he wanted to see her naked. I mean, she calls the guy El Guapo. So there’s clearly an attraction there, yes? Okay. Glad we agree on that.

Having had plans all summer to attend a certain baseball game together towards the end of the season, I balked a bit at going once The Big Easy found El Guapo’s cigarettes in my apartment and trotted out a jealous streak that was all the more surprising because I don’t share it; in my mind, friends are friends and that’s that.

But they’re not just friends. Holy balls, I can’t even keep up with her rationalizations.

Flash forward to this week, when El Guapo – someone who, until The Big Easy came along, I saw almost once a week to watch baseball and have drinks and generally enjoy each other’s company – texted to ask about getting together to watch baseball and have drinks and generally enjoy each other’s company. I said yes and we put a plan on the books. And then I brought it up with The Big Easy, who just about lost his damned mind.

 

 

 

So, she makes plans with the guy even after The Big Easy tells her he’s uncomfortable with her hanging out with El Guapo. And correct me if I’m wrong, but didn’t she originally make it sound like she hardly ever saw El Guapo? Am I remembering this incorrectly?? Now they see each other regularly? When did that happen? Is it me or is she in complete denial of her feelings for El Guapo? Also notice how she’s trying to imply that El Guapo is showing  sudden interest in hanging out because she’s seeing someone. She wants to believe he’s jealous or threatened.

 But the simple truth is that I don’t see my friendship with El Guapo as something that is in any way related to our relationship, except inasmuch as I’m a better girlfriend and a better person when I feel happy and comfortable and fulfilled, and spending time with my friends makes me feel all of those things.

More rationalizations. And what is up with the fact that she doesn’t appear to have ANY female friends? That’s just more fuel for the Cool Girl fire.

The next day, when we got back into town to head to work, he pointed me towards the subway I needed and stalked out of the station without a goodbye kiss.

Again I will point out that The Big Easy is a manipulative immature douchebag.

Why am I being treated as though I’ve done something wrong when all I’ve been is completely, brutally honest about everything??

 

She’s being treated as though she did something wrong because she was brutally honest with him. I’m sure a big reason why she’s such a tornado of drama is because she hasn’t had a boyfriend in a long time, but still. To me, it seems rather obvious why she’s being so transparent and why she still wants to hang out with a guy she affectionately nick named El Guapo: she’s attracted to him.

While I think The Big Easy is right to be uncomfortable with her still wanting to hang out with El Guapo, the way he deals with this stuff is what is troubling. He pouts, he turns the tables, he stomps off; these are not good signs. Throw in the fact that he doesn’t seem to leave her side when she’s around other guys, and this all spells trouble.

I don’t agree that it’s disrespectful if it’s not my intention to deceive him, and he doesn’t agree that I can see and do whatever I please with whomever I please.

And there it is. Now, she might very well be paraphrasing him, but I’m thinking she isn’t. I keep saying this: this guy is a controlling Helicopter Boyfriend who doesn’t like her being around other men unless he’s there to watch her. Contributing to the cluster fuck that is this relationship is that she has no idea what she’s doing or what she wants.

What’s funny is that the only time she actually goes in to any real detail about her interactions with The Big Easy is when El Guapo is involved. Other than that, all she does is give a dry run down of events.

All in all I found this post rambling and incohesive. All she does is defend herself.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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41 Responses to “Dater X: If You Banged Him, He’s Not Just A Friend”

  1. Nicki Says:

    I’ve got nothing. You’re right. If you sleep with a guy then he’s no longer “just a friend” and I totally get why TBE or any man would have an issue with that. DX seems very immature and TBE seems very controlling. The days of this relationship are numbered.

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  2. fuzzilla Says:

    **Is it me or is she in complete denial of her feelings for El Guapo?**

    No. Not just you.

    **this guy is a controlling Helicopter Boyfriend who doesn’t like her being around other men unless he’s there to watch her.**

    Well, in the case of El Guapo, I think he’s justified to feel threatened. But perhaps he is controlling beyond that and she chooses the wrong moment for pushback (“Remember how you hovered around my totally platonic male friend from work? Well, fuck you, I can go out with El Guapo whenever I want!” Um…what?).

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  3. natalie Says:

    I agree with the big east on this one. If my boyfriend told me about a girl he slept with and then told me he was still making plans to hang out with her I would have a problem with it too. It didn’t sound like dater x and el guapo had much going on in the way of friendship, they were just occasional fuck buddies, so now that she is in a relationship why does she still need to hang with el guapo. Also, I am single and I have plenty of male friends I have never slept with or done anything with, even kiss. Is it that unusual? I think not. I would not have an issue with my boyfriend having female friends a d hanging out with them but I would not want him hanging with his fuck buddies. Duh.

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    • ATWYSingle Says:

      I think he’s right to be upset, too. It’s how he’s expressing his frustration that is troubling. I don’t think his edict about hanging out with guys she slept with is confined to the big easy. I think he doesn’t want her having any contact with guys, period, unless he’s there to supervise. These two are powder keg and a match.

      The reason she hasn’t been in a relationship, I’m guessing, is that she’s attracted to guys who aren’t attracted to her.

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      • natalie Says:

        I am not sure if his jealous behavior is confined to guys she has slept with or to all guys in general. What makes you think he would act the same way of the guy was just a platonic friend or acquaintance? I don’t think we really know how he would act at this point.

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        • fuzzilla Says:

          Yeah, I don’t see him acting jealous about anyone but El Guapo. It’s possible he is and I missed it…but it seems like she’s taking TBE’s reasonable feelings about El Guapo and inflating them to make TBE look like the bad guy (“what kind of controlling jackass won’t let me see my FRIENDS?”). As if El Guapo is a synecdoche for the entirety of her social life.

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          • Greg Figueroa Says:

            What other guy friends? Sounds like she is extra focused on hanging with her new best Friend El Guapo. Like she couldn’t just not see El Guapo for a while. She has a whole softball team to talk baseball with.

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            • fuzzilla Says:

              **El Guapo, who I hasten to point out I have not seen since our margarita-fueled bed romp several weeks ago.**

              This is the phrasing of someone who thrives on drama. You can’t claim he’s of little importance to you and brag about nailing him at the same time. She’s not owning her feelings and giving mixed messages all over the place, so no wonder they’re arguing and she’s driving TBE crazy.

              Like I said a couple weeks ago, she should just dump TBE and keep El Guapo as a fuck buddy. It’s clearly what she wants. I think it’s one of those things where she just likes the status of saying she has a boyfriend, but not the actual…boyfriend.

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              • Greg Figueroa Says:

                I was thinking that, like, you said, she thrives on drama. I think El Guapo is her own planted landmine. She is making a bigger deal out of him now because something inside her likes that dynamic. She wants a reaction from ElGuapo and TBE.

                I’m sorry when you defend that F-bubby or somehow keep bringing them up, BF/GF will think there’s something up.

                I agree she likes the status of having a BF after being dessert dry for 10 years in terms of having nobody to call your own. I think the honeymoon stage is over now and now TBE will super paranoid about El Guapo, I mean he is already going crazy over El Guapo.

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      • BTownGirl Says:

        Yes, yes, yes! In my early-20’s (read: back when I had little actual relationship experience/common sense), I had a boyfriend who turned out to be an abusive loon. Wanna know what the first major sign of trouble was? He was going out of town and I mentioned that I was going to a (FEMALE!) friend’s housewarming party. He hung up on me. Then called me back, still pissy, to say, oh so sweetly, “I just don’t want you around guys when I’m not there.” Bad, BAD, sign, Dater X.

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        • fuzzilla Says:

          I used to throw parties occasionally in my 20s and I remember a friend of mine saying, “And just to piss my boyfriend off, I told him I might go to one of your parties.” Uh…okay. Did you tell him I hosted orgies or something? WTF? I lost touch with that chick long ago, but I remember her constantly complaining about her boyfriend, to the point that it was like, “Do you like ANYTHING about him? Why are you even with him?”

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          • BTownGirl Says:

            I love how you didn’t even have to meet the boyfriend to know their relationship was a cesspool! I’ve never hosted an orgy either (think what one could do to upholstery!), so I hear you there haha! ;)

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      • maria Says:

        deep down big easy knows that she is spending time with her ex fuck buddy because she is not really into him and he is forcing a relationship where one shouldn’t be, and she just doens’t know how to end things with him though its clear to all she wants out. he just wants a girlfriend and she will do. I don’t think either of these people have real feelings for each other.

        i think everyone is missing the big picture here. WHY is a woman in a brand new relationship still so eager to hang out with a man she obviously had feelings for until recently (I wager to say she still has very strong feelings for him. I say she thinks about him and fantasizes about him quite a bit. those feelings never left) I don’t think that big easy is being unreasonably jealous he is just being blind and stupid. a normal man would be more hurt by this situation than upset and pouty. he would call her out and ask why she still wants to hang out with a sexual partner from her past.

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  4. Snowflake Says:

    Look how the comments have now started to turn on her… gee you were right all along (since you first mentioned this red flag and NO ONE believed you, calling it all hokey negativity)… sheesh.. dont you hate being right :)

    Its entertaining in a train wreck kinda way.. DX 3.0

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    • ATWYSingle Says:

      I don’t think the comments turned on her, per se. I think all those people commenting have just been keeping their mouths shut because other commenters were whining about “negativity.”

      And, yes, I called it. Again.

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  5. maria Says:

    where to start??

    first of all, from the very beginning, mr big easy or whatever has always just been kind of “good enough” for dater x. she has NEVER showed feelings for him. he kind of shoehorned himself into her life from day one and she didn’t tell him no because there was no legit reason to, and maybe because of inexperience didn’t quite know how to. he’s good enough to introduce to family and friends and finally have somebody to bring home. if she had anything but lukewarm “meh” feelings for him, she would have zero desire to see her fuckbuddy–which is exactly what guapo is, nothing more nothing less. she and him have never been friends. nope. no way. she’s still hung up on him. he is the one that excites her, he is the one she wants to please and to be with. a woman in a brand new relationship should only have eyes for her man, not a guy she was fucking a couple weeks before they met. its just proof she is NOT into mr big easy at all. if she is already so bored with big easy and making eyes at her ex fuckbuddy then what chance does this relationship have in a few years?
    I think that the relationship with big easy moved really fast and she’s having a hard time controlling this speeding train. she has no real reason to break up with him but its obvious she’s not interested. I do think a lot of people get into relationships and marriages because for this very reason. its why she’s still pining for the one she is really interested in.

    Mr big easy should see that and end this relationship but he’s also one of these kinds of guys who just wants a girlfriend and doesn’t really care who is on the other end of the table until one day he’ll just up and leave because I don’t think he has any legitimate feelings for her either. they completely bypassed the fun dating and getting to know you phase and went from one date to boyfriend girlfriend, which is just a bad sign. where was the fun? where were the magical first few dates before drama of the logistics of a relationship started to take over? these people don’t even know each other, let alone like or care for each other. he’s trying to control her because he just wants a girlfriend and she is just being passive and going along with it because she just wants a boyfriend. its so obvious. she’d be much better off single and dating and sleeping with el guapo because that is what she wants to do. she is doing acrobatics just to justify that desire and its embarrassing. she and big easy have no business being together.

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  6. BTownGirl Says:

    Drama Queen With Cool Girl Delusions + Loon = What Could Go Wrong?

    Someone needs to tell this dingbat that playing “Oooh are you jealous? Are you threatened? Doesn’t that mean you love me so much?” with a guy like TBE is a boatload of dumb. And if he leaves her over it? Well, EG still isn’t going to dater her. So, good for you, DX that you’re so Chill And Evolved that you have no feelings for him. (But you do, tho.)

    I have guy friends who I’ve had relations with in the past, but we’re talking boozy college one-nighters. And our 10-year reunion was last year. Our hangouts are them bringing their wives/girlfriends/kids over to my house for a beach day, not meeting up without significant others after we’ve knocked boots six weeks prior! Even with that, my female friends still outnumber my male friends, like, 4 to 1. Can they not find one rational, self-aware woman in New York City who can string an engaging paragraph together to be Dater X?!

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  7. Yvonne Says:

    The best way to handle ex-lovers who still want to be friends is to let them know that you’re now in a relationship, and that the ex needs to be friends with both of you. That way, everything is out in the open, and no one needs to worry about anyone else’s agenda.

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    • SS Says:

      True – but also, the best way to handle current partners who don’t want you hanging with ex FWBs is to respect their feelings and wishes… not reply with “I can see and do whatever I please with whomever I please.”

      That line displays such an astonishing level of immaturity and disrespect, I can barely wrap my head around it.

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      • Yvonne Says:

        She has kind of set herself up for this by telling BE that EG was her (recent) fuck-buddy. If she’d just described him as a friend – which she goes to great lengths to claim that he is – there wouldn’t be a big issue now. It makes me think she’s trying to be the one in control of the relationship by letting him know this other guy is still in the picture. Deep down, she seems insecure. Or perhaps there is a bit of self-sabotage going on here?

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  8. SS Says:

    Who on earth could possibly have predicted introducing your FWB to your Boyfriend could end badly?!!!!!

    BWAAAAHHAhaHAHahahaaaaaaa

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  9. mxf Says:

    This bugs me:

    he doesn’t agree that I can see and do whatever I please with whomever I please

    but not in a girlfriend, he is holding you BACK kind of way. in a… grow up kind of a way. of course she’s already conceded that she can’t do “anything” she pleases with whomever she pleases – she’s committed to monogamy with new guy, for instance. she wouldn’t, i’m sure, let the old FWB guy crash at her place, even if it was all innocence. once you’re willing to acknowledge that some behaviour is inappropriate, you open the door to compromising based on how all your actions make someone else feel, rational or not.

    and good luck with the “but my heart is pure and my mind is clear, we’re just friends now” defence… i think, from a narrative point of view, she’s priming the audience for things to end with new guy because he just won’t let her be free. it could just be a story arc device.

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    • D. Says:

      Yeah, the whole thing is written to make TBE look like a controlling, jealous asshole. He may be that, but let’s not lose sight of the fact that he actually didn’t prohibit her from going to the ball game. He just made it clear that he was uncomfortable with it.

      It sounds to me like she isn’t being controlled, but rather that she’s realizing that you can’t do anything you want without consequences. And to that, all I can say is “Welcome to being a grownup.”

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      • ATWYSingle Says:

        He didn’t prohibit her from going, but he did tell her he’d be uncomfortable going with them, which we all know is what we say to someone when we don’t want them to do something. We don’t want to come out and make demands because then we’re assholes, but we will make it clear we don’t approve and hope our partners pick up what we’re throwing down. If that were me, I’d go to that game, and make it crystal clear to the “friend” that I’m aware that they slept with my partner. Because I’m an asshole like that.

        Like I said, I think he’s right to be upset. She never should have admitted she slept with El Guapo but she did because she’s inexperienced and sabotaging herself a bit. But he is most definitely a controlling ball of insecurity.

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        • D. Says:

          I’d say the thing with the cigarettes is more indicative of him being controlling. The rest could cut either way, but viewed through the lens of that incident, it suggests at least strong, strong jealousy if not actually attempting to be controlling.

          In the end, though, I’m not sure it matters a ton what the truth is, because, like mxf noted, the narrative may be headed towards “OMG, I had to break it off with him because he was super controlling.”

          This, of course, conveniently ignores what (admittedly little) she wrote before about how “easy” this was, how wonderful he was, blah blah blah. Kind of like how she had her moment with El Guapo when things were all “Date or not a date?” followed by “Sweet! I got laid!” and now she acts like “He’s like a brother to me. What’s the big deal?”

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          • BTownGirl Says:

            I think on some level, she’s sabotaging herself because she doesn’t, you know, like TBE. In any event, she shouldn’t let him cut her hair until he’s out of his snit. A bowl cut is not going to solve any of her problems, you guys.

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        • BTownGirl Says:

          I would have been like, “My friend left the cigarettes/want to go the baseball game with my friend?/I’m watching basketball with my friend”, because I’m both an asshole and a LIIIIAAAHHH!

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        • KK Says:

          You know, I’m not sure it’s really about inexperience. I think it’s more about, like you said, the self-sabotage. And it’s about a lack of self-awareness, perhaps immaturity, and I think a lack of female friends. Or even, you know, real friends, regardless of gender.

          I have very little relationship experience, and I think what’s stopped that from ruining my current relationship is the fact that I heard so much from my brother and all my friends about what sucks in relationships. Being in a relationship is the best way to learn, but, man, the learning curve changes a lot when you have friends who are honest about their struggles.

          I also wonder if perhaps Dater X is painting TBE as jealous as a way of illustrating how much he likes her. Like, you know, “my man loves me so much he is jealous.”

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  10. DrivingMeNutes Says:

    The real lessons for Dater X are as follows:

    First, brutal honesty is too blunt an instrument for managing relationships. This story illustrates very well, in fact, the pitfalls of honesty in actual, “real life” relationships as opposed to imaginary ones, where theoretical adherence to Kantian absolute principles, like “always be honest,” and “communicate” are supposedly best tool for relationships. There was never a reason to tell her boyfriend about past relationships, let alone casual ones. Q: Did you ever sleep with that guy? A: No, we are just friends. It’s not inherently disrespectful for current lovers to hang out with past ones. But, once you’ve told your boyfriend the “brutal truth,” then OF COURSE it is, in fact, disrespectful and inconsiderate to him since she knows, justifiably or not, that seeing her ex will hurt his feelings. You have to take your boyfriend’s feelings into account because that’s part of being in a real relationship.

    Which brings me right to the second and more important lesson, which is one I raised recently in a previous post. Without a foundation of mutual trust and respect (which must be (i) earned; (ii) over time) conversations and promises regarding exclusivity, commitment, the long term status of things, or anything of consequence really, are of little use, since the only mechanism of enforcement of these promises is the trust and knowledge that the other person, in fact, respects and cares about you, which either already exists or it doesn’t. In Dater X’s case, they haven’t known each other long enough to have earned each other’s trust and respect, so all they’ve got is a bunch of useless and empty statements, promises and reassurances.

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    • D. Says:

      Well said. Well said, indeed.

      The thing that I kept coming back to in reading her piece was how focused on herself it was. She wants to retain her independence. She doesn’t think her boyfriend ought be bothered by her hanging out with a guy he knows used to fuck her (and whom she’ll probably go back to occasionally fucking if/when this implodes). Why? Because she doesn’t define him as more than a friend. (Never mind the fact that truly platonic friends don’t have sex with each other…)

      It all just suggests someone who is not in a real relationship. In a real relationship, you take your partner’s feelings into account. Meaning that, even if you think it’s absurd that they’re bothered by you hanging out with your former fuck buddy, you choose not to, because you don’t want to hurt them.

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  11. Greg Figueroa Says:

    Tell me If I wrong, but doesn’t it sound like she makes plans for El Guapo and TBE has to find his way in to do stuff with her. It would bother me that my GF says she is super busy with work and softball games, but that she has no problem making plans with her recent F-buddy. . .multiple plans at that.

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    • fuzzilla Says:

      It could be that she’s at the “we’re assumed to have plans” stage with TBE. People in serious relationships usually are hanging with their boo every weekend, and it takes more of a concerted effort to make plans with/keep in touch with friends.

      BUT she clearly is giving the impression that El Guapo is a lot more important to her than TBE. She just assumes TBE is being a dick and not considering his side at all. I’m sure if El Guapo got a girlfriend he’d drop her like a hot potato without a second thought.

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  12. Francesca Says:

    That’s so effed up as a reasoning, Dater X. I have a male friend that I’ve been platonic with for eight years, and by platonic I mean: nothing. EVER. Happened. Nothing. When people see us together, they get there is nothing there. None of my bfs have ever been jealous because we genuinely treat each other like siblings and it shows. If I hadn’t felt I could do that, we wouldn’t be this close. I agree that the Big Easy sounds really creepy, but tbh I’d be wary of anyone who basically claims that ‘fucking your male friends is just what you do sometimes’. Ehrm, it’s not, because you know, you can keep it in your pants if you try. I promise.

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  13. Mandy Says:

    First, her description about how she’s sooooooo unusual and special is sickening. She’s exactly the same as millions of other girls out there. Ugh. That is probably why she doesn’t have any female friends. People who think they’re the exception to everything are impossible to be around.

    Second, I never got the sense she liked the Big Easy at all. All she likes is how nice he’s been to her, and how much attention he’s given her. She’s never once talked about what, as a person, attracts her to him. Yeah, she’s said he’s cute and funny or whatever, but when you really like someone it comes across. It came across with El Guapo for sure. But she’s only with the Big Easy because she wants to be with someone, and so did he.

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    • fuzzilla Says:

      Yeah, when she talks about what she likes about The Big Easy or their relationship, she seems so uncomfortable, like she has to do so while walking with a book on her head (and if the book drops, we’ll know she’s a lying liar who lies). Meanwhile she relishes describing “margarita-fueled sex romps several weeks ago” with good ol’ buddy, ol’ pal El Guapo.

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  14. Isambard Says:

    “The Big Easy found El Guapo’s cigarettes”

    ah..hrrm…

    over by the window
    there’s a pack of cigarettes
    not my brand
    you understand
    sometimes a girl forgets

    Thank you for the opportunity to sing Rupert Holmes a cappella.

    I was going to say more, but there are so many things wrong here that it would take all day.

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  15. Lucy Says:

    I don’t understand why you would bring up an old friends with benefits to a new boyfriend. Either that’s very naïve, you have few boundaries or lack emotional intelligence. As someone said above, if you think relationships should involve 100% honesty about everything then that just isn’t how it works. It her admission is a little insensitive. Don’t get me wrong, I wouldn’t deny it if it were me and asked outright, but there’s no reason to bring that up at all. Almost seems like needless drama/attention-seeking.

    And then why would you choose to hang out one on one with someone that your boyfriend is uncomfortable with? No guys I’ve had intimate contact with are on my radar at the moment. I agree that the guy shouldn’t be as possessive as he is though.

    I also don’t believe in the whole “I’m a cool chick” stuff. I mean I’m far from angelic myself and I’ve seen how certain men have treated me differently depending on our interactions and I’m certainly not comfortable with anything casual for that reason. No, men I’ve been casual with are not my friends and don’t respect me nearly as much.

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  16. SB Says:

    This week’s post is so full of issues, it kind of makes me think we’re being played. Are we being trolled or does she live in a cave? Nothing that she thinks makes her special makes her special. The way she describes herself describes the majority of unlucky in love chicks that we all know, and what women can’t maintain years long actual platonic male friendships? Most of the women I know, including myself, can. In fact, the women I know who have been single forever but wish they weren’t can *only* have platonic male friendships, whether they wish for more or not, and those of us who date regularly keep the two groups of men in our lives separate. Platonic friends do not get any type of intimacy at all; those I date or casually sleep with do, and sometimes we pretend to hang out as friends (but we both know better). Always with the ones I’ve slept with, when either he or I gets into a new relationship, we explain it to the other and understand that means no more in-person meet ups for even platonic reasons until after the relationship is over.
    Her perspective is so naive, especially for someone as old as she is.

    *scratches head*

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