When Do You Stop Looking For Love?

chem

More juicy goodness from The NY Post.

I left New York City so I could feel hotter

Now,  I don’t disagree with the premise of this article. People in New York City can be shallow as fuck. I’ve often complained about never feeling good enough for the men on Bumble and OKCupid. But I’ve also said, time and again, that there are just some men I will never pull, and that’s okay.

For Zoë Barry, feeling attractive in New York was an impossible feat. The 32-year-old, who grew up in Stuy Town and attended an all-girls private school, says her self-esteem was slowly sapped by the city’s sky-high beauty standards. “As a woman, you’re never enough,” says the sporty 5-foot-6 CEO. “I was never tall enough or slim enough. It grates on you after a while — that pressure to be a walking mannequin.”

So Barry pulled a confidence-boosting move that more and more New Yorkers are considering lately: She fled NYC for a city that actually appreciates her.

Soon after, Barry, who had been working on Wall Street, decamped for Breckenridge, Colo., where she became a “ski bum.” A flood of male attention quickly followed. “All of a sudden I was the belle of the ball,” she says. “In Colorado, it was like, ‘Look at her!’ In New York, I couldn’t find a nice guy anywhere.”

Ah, yes. The “I couldn’t find a nice guy anywhere” line. I will once more say that I agree that – when it comes to dating – Manhattan can be competitive and soul-crushing. It’s very difficult to confront the reality that you are no longer in demand like you once where. But confront it you must. From where I sit, Barry’s problem was two-fold: she lived in a city notorious for being dog-eat-dog when it comes to jobs and status and looks AND she was blind to her own shallowness. No nice guys in NYC? Sorry, I’ve been here almost thirty years. That simply is not true. Whenever I hear a woman bemoan the lack of “nice guys” in Manhattan, what I hear is, “The only men that show interest in me are the players and men I don’t find attractive.” We need to stop perpetuating the myth that there are no good guys left. There are a multitude of honorable men out there, we just reject them.

I say we because I do it, too. Contributing to my perpetually single status is that I am attracted to men who – more often then not – have an abundance of options. I’m attractive, but in most cases I am not attractive enough to get the attention of a man with his pick of the litter.  That said, I don’t necessarily think it’s a bad idea to move to a place where you are in high demand. The catch is understanding that – eventually – your desirability will wane. Nobody – no man, no woman – can stay hot forever. Pay close attention to how people used to talk about Brad Pitt and Angeline Jolie’s looks versus how they’re looks are currently discussed. I think the problem the people interviewed in this article face is that they’re attracted to people who aren’t attracted to them, at least not enough to commit to them.

So, what do you do if you regularly find yourself attracted to people who don’t return the interest? That’s the real conundrum, isn’t it? My sister frequently hints to me that I should be less concerned with physical attraction when looking for men to date. As maddening as that sounds, she’s not wrong. I mean, she’s not 100% right, either, but what she’s suggesting isn’t far-fetched. It’s just…I don’t want to. I’m still holding out for that tear-your-clothes-off chemistry.  But that is a choice I own. I know it could mean never finding a partner. That’s a very difficult reality to accept. At almost fifty years-old, how much longer is my sex drive going to be this high? Am I being realistic? No, I’m not, but I’m not ailling to adjust my expectations.

I had a date last night at a very fancy Madison Avenue bar. He was attractive. The conversation flowed effortlessly. I genuinely enjoyed his company. But I knew the minute he walked in there wasn’t going to be a spark. Am I the only one picks up on stuff like that? It’s not a feeling I can quantify in any way, I just know. I miss having that initial rush of electricity. I’m scared I’ll never feel that again. I want to feel that again. There are a number of mid-fifties men at my gym that I find attractive but it’s so hard to forge any sort of substantive connection there. I’ve already shared my thoughts on online dating. (PS? I opened my Bumble app for the first time in months. Yikes. It’s fast becoming Tinder as far as quality goes. Has anyone else noticed this?)

I guess I’m wondering at what point should a person give up?

Thoughts?

 

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34 Responses to “When Do You Stop Looking For Love?”

  1. Nia Says:

    I think there’s a middle ground, which is maybe focusing on your own stuff as a primary and sort of…letting go of dating as a focus.
    I know that when I was doing online dating intensely I was miserable. The guys I met and had any sort of chemistry or possibility with were 90% offline–two FWB I met at the same networking group (at different times, heh).

    I just wanted to drop this here (and this may sound like what many women say that is dismissed as “settling”)
    I wrote an email about my now-BF to my best friend that specified that he had “no sexual heat”. It wasn’t the same as not feeling attraction, but it certainly wasn’t rip your pants off. I feel a strong, consistent attraction to him with spikes of “wow, get over here”—what I call “husband hots”. It’s the little things–seeing him effortlessly crouched on his haunches playing with our cats, or when he helps me lift something heavy, and his muscles pop up.

    I’ve had “rip your pants off holy shit” chemistry and attraction before and with due respect to cough cough Evan Marc Katz, it DID lead me astray. I filled in the blanks with an idea of a good person because I wanted them physically so much and the sex/physical stuff was so strong.

    Now I’m older/wiser and I feel that my love and attraction is like a fire on a rainy cold day, not a bonfire at the edge of a dry woods :)

    I say pull back and focus on your book, your biz, and yourself. You don’t have to say “I give up forever.”

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  2. Noquay Says:

    I’d say give up at about age 80. Ironically, I live about 30-35 miles from Breck. It’s great if you want a ski bum (read min wager living with 6 dudes in a rental) and are into hooking up. Not so much if you’re older, have done something with your life, and want a real relationship with an equal. In this part of the mountain West we have a saying “the odds are good but the goods are odd”, sad but true

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    • KK Says:

      Why give up at 80? I saw this docunentary about this Austrian Jewish sports club that existed in the 1920s and 30s. In 2005 they had a reunuion for everyone who was still.alive. two of its members, in their 80s, fell in love.

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  3. Speed Says:

    Many people read this blog for inspiration and advice. You are a leading dating advisor. When you suggest giving up, it’s like desertion by an officer in combat, justifying the decision by shouting backwards over her shoulder to her platoon, “things are too tough.”

    As to attraction…after several decades of dating, education, experience, travel, reading and even interaction with the online ELIZA AI psychology system, I came to the same conclusion that my grandmother could have told me (and has been sort of common sense for thousands of years):

    1. What feels good is not necessarily good for me.

    2. I don’t need high levels of attraction to be with someone.

    3. Marriage or couple hood is about (A) companionship (B) access to at least semi-3. consistent sex (C) productivity (shared labor power and wealth) (D) child rearing. Anything else positive is a bonus.

    4. The qualities necessary for successful relationships or marriage have nothing to do with superficialities like good looks, humor, style, charisma, etc.

    5. Qualities necessary for relationships or marriage are things like consistency, resilience, diplomacy, commitment, ability to communicate, valuation on family and friends, willingness to work hard, etc.

    6. Too many (but not all) hot people are spoiled and toxic and can even damage your life. The ride isn’t worth the price.

    7. Discipline my mind and sober and calm my psyche to accept the person that is best for me. Give up fantasies and desires for a logical analysis of what is best. Prayerful meditation also helped me here.

    8. I am not getting younger.

    The old commenter “Trouble” once wrote, “For marriage, you need a workhorse, not a show pony.” I couldn’t agree more.

    I can’t say this is advice for anyone for me. I’m just relating my own journey. For others, a self-aware quest for hot feelings and excitement can be just as valid. I certainly work with a ton of people like that.

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    • Bluegrass Says:

      I love this advice. I really want to get into that mindset if I can’t find someone in the next few years. The thing is that, while you can understand on a cerebral level that it’s wise to go for compatibility and not looks when looking for a long term relationship, it feels like you’re the only one doing that sometimes. I mean, it’s not like you have loads of examples of people writing articles saying, “I’m only modestly attracted to my spouse, and I love my marriage”, because writing stuff like that may feel like a betrayal of one’s spouse. So, if you’re looking for guidance or examples of the behavior you’re aspiring to, you kind of have to look around and be like, “Well they’re probably not that into each other” (which doesn’t feel very nice, but the whole point is that something very meaningful and fulfilling can happen between people that are only modest attracted to each other (or where one spouse is at least).

      I think another thing that’s troublesome for me is that I’m really into a lot of guys, but still having trouble attracting them. I think this is one difference between people for whom dating out of their league is trying to bag a GQ model and people who are just trying for guys that most people would characterize as average. I encounter so many guys that I’m into that it feels like I should be able to find one if I just wait long enough (when that may not be the case). I think it would be easier for me to consign myself to being with someone where I don’t have a fiery attraction to them if cute guys were a little less common. It may have something to do with being from NY.

      The thing is, I realize that the passion in a relationship usually doesn’t last that long, but I can’t find anyone that’s modeling skipping it altogether. In general, what little there is tends to be tied up in religion (where marriage can be more about fulfilling God’s divine plan for you than about any special feelings you feel for someone else), but I’m not particularly religious. I’m hoping that some brilliant writer or philosopher will come up with a rallying cry that enables people to feel proud dating for qualities other than attraction. We’ll see if that happens.

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      • fuzzilla Says:

        **I mean, it’s not like you have loads of examples of people writing articles saying, “I’m only modestly attracted to my spouse, and I love my marriage”, because writing stuff like that may feel like a betrayal of one’s spouse.**

        I remember Moxie posted a link to an article a while ago where the guy was like, “I used to be all about hot women but I settled and got married and look how happy I am now!” And yes, the guy did come off smug and insulting to his wife, and the whole article read like a thinly veiled advertisement for the wife’s mother/daughter run matchmaking company.

        I think that saying, “I look at my partner and just think – meh, they’re okay, I guess” is the wrong way to look at it. No one is saying to forget about physical attraction, but it shouldn’t be your *focus* or the #1 thing you look for. The focus should be on how they make you feel. Like, they always make you laugh, even after a completely crap day, or you know they’ll be there for you when sh** gets real. I get that it can be hard to select for these things when you’re just looking at profiles on the Internet, but those are the things that really matter in a relationship – those are the “workhorses.”

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    • Parenting Says:

      This is great advise! No matter how hot you were for your lover in the beginning, it becomes a nice simmer at some point in the LTR. Perhaps you need the mad lust in the beginning to keep you coming back until the relationship reaches a comfortable point. But with time, the friendship and kindness becomes so much more important that an exorbitant focus on raw lust may not be productive as far as “finding love” goes because it just doesnt last that long.

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  4. michelle Says:

    My brother Over 60 just got married last weekend There is hope And he did not settle nor did she They ate both good looking smart and savvy now living their lives to the fullest

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  5. Mandy Says:

    “I had a date last night at a very fancy Madison Avenue bar. He was attractive. The conversation flowed effortlessly. I genuinely enjoyed his company. But I knew the minute he walked in there wasn’t going to be a spark. Am I the only one picks up on stuff like that? It’s not a feeling I can quantify in any way, I just know. I miss having that initial rush of electricity.”

    The “spark” you describe, to me, sounds like the rush you get when you are just outright sexually attracted to someone’s looks and vibe without knowing anything else about them. For me at least, and from what I’ve read about you, probably you too…at lot of time that vibe is something that is not exactly hallmarks of a healthy relationship (classic “bad boy” vibes). The rush is fun, but it doesn’t last either–at least not as part of a long-term meaningful relationship.

    You found the guy attractive, and you liked him. Why not give it a chance (with him, or anyone else who you find attractive and like), and see if a DIFFERENT type of spark and rush and electricity happens down the line? I think this is what many people dismiss–they’ve never felt the different type of spark and rush of electricity, so they dismiss the person because they didn’t feel the original spark they’ve felt before. Maybe instead of being explosive from the getgo, the sex will be good to start, and then get amazing once that spark and rush develops in a different way. I firmly believe it’s not “settling” to give an attractive guy who you like a chance!

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    • fuzzilla Says:

      Eh, I don’t exactly disagree but I think I know what Moxie means. I’ve had plenty of perfectly pleasant dates where the the guy was attractive but the chemistry just wasn’t there. It isn’t necessarily all about sex, it’s something in your personalities clicking or not.

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    • Smokey Says:

      I’ve had that intense rush twice. And both led to one night stands and nothing else. Part of the rush was the fact that they were going to be a challenge. Part of it was the fact that I thought they were out of my league (and probably were) all of the intense feelings weren’t healthy feelings for a relationship. That’s how I feel about when people describe sparks. That’s all it is. On the flip side I’ve dated perfectly nice guys who for whatever reason I felt nothing for, good or bad. My boyfriend now didn’t play games with me, didn’t have that dangerous rush that gave me soaked but he made me think about him. He was so fucking respectful and nice and different and interesting that who cares about something like sparks? Or maybe the sparks were there but just different. But I do know there wasn’t an intensity with the sparks when we first mets doesn’t mean I wasn’t attracted and doesn’t mean that I wanted to tear his clothes of right away. It was more meaningful somehow.ge made me think. He treated me well. Our dates were fun and thoughtful. That’s what matters to me at this point in my life. #shrug

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  6. Bluegrass Says:

    Good post. I agree, I find the “I can’t find nice guys anywhere” line a little irksome, because it disregards the numerous nice guys that are in NYC that the letter writer is not attracted to. That having been said, it’s hard for me to begrudge certain people from trying to date people they’re attracted to even if they’re a bit out of their league, so long as they are polite when rejecting others and not simply trying to date the fanciest person they can for their ego’s sake.

    I have difficulty getting guys that I’m into to date me, and have considered the possibility of reconsidering people that I’ve passed over. I think it’d be different if I could tell who was really into me and who is just flattering me and looking to just get laid. The thing is, if neither of us is really into the other, then what are we doing together? This is one reason that I try to make it very clear to the guys I’ve met up with (who are a little out of my league) that I’m very appreciative and into what we’re doing, even though part of me worries that it comes across as a lack of confidence on my part. I dunno, it’s a balancing act. I think bars might be a better place to quickly gauge degree of attraction since they see you in the flesh right away.

    I am aware that, historically, marriages were mostly for economic reasons. I kind of wish that ethos were more common nowadays, because I do want to get married I think, but, with the capitalist emphasis on good sex (which is understandable but when is it throwing the baby out with the bath water), that it would be very lonely being in a relationship where you’re ambivalent about your attraction to your partner. If there were more of a social movement that made people like that feel seen and acknowledged, I think it would be better. As it stands, it’s kind of like when you smile, the whole world smiles with you, but when you’re perturbed, it’s alone.

    In terms of how long to try dating, I say don’t give up entirely for a long time, but I can relate to what Nia said about online dating taking a toll on one’s self esteem. So I guess it’s good to take breaks. I’m going to try for 5 years, I think (I’m 32) and then seriously reevaluate my standards.

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  7. CT Says:

    I don’t think it has to be so black and white. Why not live your life and keep your heart open to what may happen? Life does not usually go in the direction we try to steer it or what it to go. It’s constantly evolving. What you’ve said about finding someone is not necessarily a reality; it’s a conclusion drawn from past experiences. Conclusions aren’t always reality. Giving up sounds so permanent. I say live your life and keep your heart open. As for immediate attraction, the za za zou is only one way to feel when you meet someone. It may be what you are most comfortable following, or what “feels” the best. I am positive that there’s other reactions to be had to men that while not the norm or what you’ve wanted in the past, they can lead to something great. It may be a different experience and not what you are used to; isn’t that what life is all about? Stepping out on the branch once in a while?

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  8. myself Says:

    Well, I don’t know if I’m a prime example myself, and I’m certainly not in NYC, but I haven’t given up per se, but I don’t make much of an effort anymore. I’m seeing someone I met offline, and it sort of happened organically. Is he perfect? Nope. Is he a nice guy? Yep. Am I attracted to him? Yep, and vv. But it’s not like it was when I was younger. My criteraa have changed considerably (is he breathing and have a job? – just kidding!).

    I don’t think it’s giving up to continue to live your life despite not having found “the one”, and I think your life is pretty damned full. I also don’t think it’s wrong to continue to hope. They say that “you’ll know”…meh I suspect it’s all timing…NYC may be different however, but it’s all about what you can live with IMO.

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  9. BTownGirl Says:

    Ironically enough, my advice is to stop listening to everyone else, other people’s experiences, and what you think you know based on your own past experiences. Now is the perfect moment for you to wipe the slate clean and say, “I don’t care how many letters I’ve gotten over the years about how hard it is to meet someone in NY or how hard I may have found it in the past. None of those people are me, they’re not living my life, and I’m not the same person I was even just last year.” That probably sounds all Pollyanna and shit, but when I finally stopped making decisions based on what other people were doing, what other people thought I should be doing, and various neuroses from failed relationship past, everything changed and I had my stuff together to meet my fiance. You’re absolutely right not to go for someone who doesn’t give you a rush of attraction, because it’s important to you and it will be important to the person who’s right for you. Sure, give it a second date if you’re not sure and don’t psych yourself out of it as a way of protecting yourself from getting hurt, but go for what you want. Put the narrative about being less desirable at this point aside and enjoy your life. No one gets to the end of their life and thinks, “Wow, I really wish I’d spent more time beating myself up!” You have too much to offer the world, the partner who’s right for you, and yourself to do that.

    P.s. As I typed that last sentence, Anthony Scaramucci got shitcanned. Take it as a sign!!

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  10. Jaclyn Says:

    As far as accepting a second date, my standard always was,”does he seem like a genuinely kind person?” Has he thrown off any red flags indicating he is extremely commitment adverse (dude the story about how you refused to propose to your long term girlfriend and she broke up with you and married your best friend is not first date material. Plus I’m just happy for her).

    Chemistry might develop over time if you give things a chance.

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  11. Zaire Says:

    I don’t think you should give up. Personally, I’m in the “exploring other options” phase of life. Like Nia said I started to find online dating very depressing. The more I put in the less I got out. So I closed all my accounts and I’m happy doing things alone or with friends. I’m working out harder and seeing great results. I have a qualifying exam coming and I’m preparing for that. My life is pretty full. Also, I feel more connected to the world in a weird way. I notice people and speak to strangers more often. I force myself to speak to non-threatening people who make eye contact and look friendly. My social skill have always been good but they are improving regarding cold contact.

    I’m not someone who dates based off of “spark” but I’m not going to tell you to stop if that’s what you like. The last guy I went out with I wasn’t all that attracted to in pictures. In person we got along very well but he still wasn’t my type physically but I was willing to give it a go, he didn’t ask me out again (go figure). My point is even dating outside you your preference or habits doesn’t gaurentee a positive result so do what you know will make you happy in the end.

    Also, and this relates to Bluegrass’s point, I’m not going to endorse you going out with guys who know you don’t click with when I don’t see any evidence ANYWHERE that that’s how people at large are dating. It’s hard for me to justify telling someone (or myself) to play by rules no one else is playing by. While everyone could use some checks and balances on their standards dating is not charity. I can almost gaurentee you the men who want to date you aren’t asking out of the goodness of their hearts. You meet whatever initial requirement they have. People can call it bitterness or whatever but I’m not going to cut someone slack when 9 times out of 10 they wouldn’t do it if the shoe was on the other foot.

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    • Bluegrass Says:

      Yeah, and to the point about not dating people you don’t have a spark with, I find that it seldom works out if you try to date lower to find someone who is more interested. Guys actually get a boost in my mind if I’m attracted to them but find them likely to be more in my league than others, but in my experience they seldom return the enthusiasm (despite these being people I’ve matched with). It’s almost a little easier to date higher (though this may vary depending on what the person is looking for and how common it is).

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    • Nia Says:

      I do agree. I don’t advocate dating with no sparks, that’s setting yourself up for a feeling of mild to moderate discontent your whole marriage/relationship.
      I do advocate for shifting what makes the sparks—from a physical body and aura/chi (how he carries himself) *only* to a “total package”. How he speaks, walks, moves, treats others, connects with you, his character, his true personality that you get to know over time.
      I don’t think you have to give anyone a “chance”. Maybe take the focus off the dating part—go out as friends (I feel Moxie came close with a recent guy that unfortunately was not interested, but I felt the seeds of the way forward with “the one” were there).
      I was going through emails I wrote about my first “dates” with my now BF to write him a card with a few lines from them included, and I found a striking consistent—I said more than once “I don’t really need to know where this is going” or “I’m okay just hanging out and seeing what happens.”

      That has *never* been the case before, NEVER. And it may have been due to a more steady, lower level of sizzling attraction. I didn’t feel denied or “hungry” when we were just friends. I felt like sure, I’d like to be with him if that’s the way it goes, but I can think straight around the man, and I’m not borderline angry he’s not making moves right now because I want him so much.

      Also, to be frank, it allows me to draw boundaries and have hard conversations because I’m not blinded by “ugh, he’s so friggin’ hot.” like I was with my ex, literally the most beautiful (to me) man I’ve ever been with. His physical beauty and our chemistry was so intense he got away with *a ton* he shouldn’t have because I thought “what if I never have a man this gorgeous again?”

      You know what? I won’t. And that’s 1000% okay with me!

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      • fuzzilla Says:

        Yeah, it’s not like people are either drop dead gorgeous or ugly with no variations in between. Especially for people want to get married and have kids, it’s like, do you look at their values and how they treat you *in addition to* their looks, or is your choice based solely on, like, a swimsuit competition?

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  12. Annabelle Says:

    Give up? Settle? I’ve considered both, but I guess hope springs eternal. I’ve tried to force myself to be attracted to men who are “good catches” but that I’m not that physically attracted to. It always goes badly. I’ve hooked up with men who are “out of my league,” but it never lasts. I’ve tried adjusting my league to be more realistic, but, lol, there have to be some limits to the desperation. As many of us have found, online dating can be soul-crushing. Dating men met off-line is only slightly better. I think the answer is to live your life, find activities you enjoy, and stay open to all possibilities.

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  13. Yvonne Says:

    “He was attractive. The conversation flowed effortlessly. I genuinely enjoyed his company. But I knew the minute he walked in there wasn’t going to be a spark.”

    Isn’t a guy like this worth giving a second date, if he’s interested? He was attractive and the conversation was great, but you knew the minute he walked in that there wouldn’t be chemistry? I could see not wanting to go forward if you found him attractive, but the conversation was somehow off, or if the conversation was great, but you found him physically unappealing. But just because this man didn’t fit your picture of your ideal type, doesn’t make him automatically wrong for you.

    I’m not saying that a second date will necessarily change things, but it could. It almost sounds like you are psyching yourself out by making a split-second determination before you’ve actually met. Decisions about LTRs shouldn’t be based on something so ephemeral.

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  14. Smokey Says:

    People who are so obsessed with “tear your clothes off chemistry” are the same as people who won’t date a many under 6’5. It’s an excuse for staying single and comfortable because it’s all you know. You don’t want a relationship. I don’t think you even know what a relationship entails moxie to be honest. The works it takes m. And it has little to do with height, lightening rod chemistry or anything else stupid and meaningless like that. I’m not implying anybody have a relationship with someone they cannot stand and have no attraction to but there is a line and nonsense excuses are just that. People like you just don’t want relationships because you don’t understand them. Do you think the kind of chemistry you describe lasts year after year after year? Attraction yes it can come and go but intense sparks? That happens in movies. It takes work and love and dedication and the desire to share your life with a partner who respects you, treats you well and loves you. You can tell from the second you lay eyes on a guy that he’s not good for you? Just please admit to yourself and your family and your readers that you’re happy in your life and don’t want a relationship. Date, have sex but don’t get frustrated because you’re jealous of cute couples. You think every happy couple has the insane chemistry that you are demanding? Men your age are already low in testosterone and aren’t going to be horny like they are when they were 25. Many of them want companionship and want to love someone not intense chemistry like this is a Nicholas sparks novel or lifetime movie. Sex drive in men decreases as they age. Doesn’t diminish but they aren’t not like women who’s sex drive peaked when they’re a little older. You have very childish ideas about relationships. You only care about looks and chemistry and sorry but that makes for great one night stands but that’s about it

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    • ATWYSingle Says:

      My father and my sisters were and are crazy about their spouses. They all had the initial intense chemistry. I saw it. I *felt* it. There’s also no divorce in my family. That date I had? He wasn’t interested in me, either. That’s what I picked up on. I totally would have gone out with him again, even though I didn’t feel any spark at first.

      I grew up watching my father carry my mother from room to room because she was too weak from cancer to move. That was the same man who died because he got a surgery he didn’t need so he could be around to care for his dying wife. My sister and her husband were close to bankruptcy years ago and almost split up but are still together 30 years later. Another sister put her head on her dying husband’s chest while he took his last breath.

      I swear to God, don’t you ever fucking lecture me about risk and dedication and sacrifice and compromise and pain and all the other things that solid relationships entail. All those things I just listed? *That* is all I know. I’m holding out for that, not somebody I can sound reasonably attracted to in my preachy comments on a fucking blog.

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  15. Jack Says:

    Zoe Barry means that “I couldn’t find a nice guy anywhere who was 6’+, had all his hair, and made 200K+”

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    • Nia Says:

      Hm. I’m pretty sure NYC is full of guys that meet at least 2 out of those criteria.
      I think it’s a harmful belief that women “only” want men who are tall, have a full head of hair, and/or make a certain amount of money.
      Next time you’re in the mall, or out at a restaurant, take a look at the real couples. You’ll see tons and tons of average looking people, both male and female.
      Are there some women who want those things? Sure. But Zoe is an active, attractive 24 year old. She’s kind of the target market for tall, attractive, successful men. She’s kind of…not shooting out of her league here. She’s just surrounded by tons and tons of *stunning* women.
      When one makes angry generalizations, one winds up seeing them everywhere.
      What you focus on you get more of.

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      • Jack Says:

        Apparently, she was shooting out of her league, in NYC at least. That’s why she moved. The men she was interested in weren’t willing to commit to her.

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  16. Benny Says:

    Meant to write this here

    Everyone I’ve known who has downplayed the importance of physical chemistry has either settled or cheated or both.

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    • fuzzilla Says:

      That or they’re tired of getting burned by people who bring nothing to the table *but* looks.

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      • fuzzilla Says:

        In other words, that kind of comment is often more about past relationships and mistakes they wanna avoid rather than how lame their current relationship is.

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    • BTownGirl Says:

      Yup!! I’m in my mid-30’s and I’m already starting to see people who gave up on chemistry because they were worried about not finding anyone before it was “too late” having major issues in their marriages or getting divorced. Anyone who says you don’t need it to happily sustain a long relationship is full of it, frankly.

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      • Nia Says:

        Arg, no one is saying give up on all chemistry whatsoever! They’re saying look for a slow burn, or a steady, easy, comfort zone with some sparks. Not hold out for rip your pants off or the fairy tale or your ideal body type/looks.

        I agree that strong steady physical chemistry is important. You need sex, love, and physical affection to get you through the tough times and to differentiate your relationship from that of a roommate. But what people are saying is that rip your pants off chemistry can:

        Cause you to shoot out of your league

        Cause you to overlook serious character flaws or incompatibility

        Cause you to overlook potential mates that might be a great fit but have less roaring fire chemistry with you

        Cause you to doubt your own attractiveness if you can’t find that hot level of sparks

        That’s all

        Sure, “giving up” and settling for a friend is going to backfire. I would never advise that.

        But giving someone who you have some sparks with (like Moxie did with the one guy) and letting them grow, that’s another thing entirely.

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        • BTownGirl Says:

          For sure, people with counterproductive or unhealthy patterns need to check themselves when it comes to chemistry! For everyone else, I think it depends on what they need to be happy. I’ll use myself as an example, because a slow burn wouldn’t do it for me. Not to sound like a degenerate, but one of the ways I knew I wanted to be with my fiance forever was thinking, “You’re the sexiest man I’ve ever seen and I don’t think I’ll ever, ever get enough of f*cking you.” (Did I just write my vows?! Totally.) Again, everyone’s different, but for me personally, I’m glad I waited for it and I totally get people who want to do the same!

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  17. AnnieNonymous Says:

    In all honesty, I’ve found that men (and people, really) truly are nicer once you pull away from the northeast corridor. It’s not for nothing that the Northeast has a reputation for rudeness. Whenever I’ve taken trips to other cities or states, I’m unnerved by how kind people are to me. It takes me a minute to get over my feeling of, “Why are they so nice? They must be trying to get something from me” and accept that these people are simply nice. My trips into NYC are essentially an exercise in seeing how crappy and rude people are. If this woman couldn’t get a date in NYC and is suddenly swimming in men in her new city, it’s probably true that there’s a different local flavor to the people.

    I’ve given up on the type of men who have unrealistic aspirations, particularly creative ones. The men who think their bands will hit it big, or who want to be directors, or who talk about launching a startup but never get around to it. They put their private lives in a holding position because they think they’re two months away from getting famous. When they do date, they choose women who are at least two notches below them, in a reflection of their own lack of confidence and financial security. NYC has a higher percentage of men like this than any other city besides LA. Once you get away from flashy artsy/bohemian crowds and immerse yourself in groups of people with normal jobs, it’s surprising how naturally and easily you’ll start to be asked out. No more gallery owners or actors or writers. Go where the people with stable jobs go, because they’re the ones with normal ideas about how life works.

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